1999 Adventure 208 Hull Problems

[langski93]

My 99 is showing the cracks in the lower corners of the transom notch that is a sign of water entrance that many are familiar with. they are about 1.5 to 2" in length, not bulging and not wide open. I have done the bang test and I can notice such a slight change in sound between the cracks and the close surrounding area, I actually wonder if the sound is truly different. The sound of tapping the rest of the transom gives a good tap and Ring sound along with the bounce of the hammer. I plan on getting a moisture meter on it.

I have had the boat 10 years (?)years as second owner, never painted and kept in very nice condition. Its never been left in the water and always well covered when not used. Minimally, I'm thinking of removing the motor and aluminium trim strip to access the situation and addressing the issues found.

At what point of damage do I replace the whole transom. If damage appears minimal, can it be satisfactorily arrested short of a full transom replacement. I did the work on a Bertram Moppie 20 full transom replacement using coosa, so I am familiar with process and in a weird way kind of liked it. That said, I am not getting any younger though and I would like to use the boat before I die. I called a boat shop with a good reputation and they said $7k to completely replace the transom only, more if they find other issues.

A friend who is very familiar with working on sailboats suggested I look into sistering an aluminum plate on both sides of the transom making it a composite sandwich comprised of gelcoat, fiberglass, Plywood and metal, including zincs all through bolted together. I would still have to seal off the top of the notch, but if the transom is still 90% solid, wouldn't this be an effective solution?

Issue number 2 There is a soft spot on the floor, starboard side, just rear of the captain's chair. It drives me nuts. I cannot access it as the sole only has the small inspection plates, which means I am going to have to cut the section out and probably more. The question is, am I the only Adventure owner that does not have a large removable deck panel above the fuel tank? All floor repairs I have seen on line focus on repairing the panel and reinstalling. Lucky me.

Anyway, its been a great boat, I don't want to sell, it shows well, and just needs some loving. All suggestion, input and ideas are always appreciated.

Langski


port side visible just below manky screw

Starboard and I loosened the screw.

 

[billyttpd]

You present an interesting scenario. I am a 96 Adventure owner and while I would never neglect my boat to the point of being detrimental to safety, how much am i going to invest in an almost 30 year old boat that I own?

A 7k dollar transom job is equal to what I purchased my boat for in 2009. I had to repower it as the engine on it had a blown powerhead. but I've always kept it in the back of mind how much is too much to spend on this boat? I've decided that the Grady has been a great boat especially where I used it Cape May and Delaware Bay. I probably would not make the investment if my transom went bad.

I don't think there is a wrong answer to your question. You may decide to replace the transom you may move on as well. Think it out and do what's best for you. If a competent shop says its usable and cosmetic you have peace of mind and could continue to enjoy your boat keeping this issue in the back of your mind but not losing sleep over it. My question is the shop you dealt with said 7K to start. Start what? A transom replacement or repair.? Also a consideration is if you're that happy with the boat (they are great boats) 7k may be a wise investment. It is certainly much less than the roughly 145K price of a new 218.

I have the same cracks you do and I routinely inspect the transom notch to make sure things aren't worsening. Transom sometime go wet on their own. My 28 year old boat with the transom drilled a few times for transducers and a swim ladder probably is a little damp as well. I have already had the fuel tank hatch recoring done and the deck in my boat is rock solid. I have also had all four hatches re glassed and they delaminated again. I guess my point is if my transom went really bad I would probably replace the boat.

I'm actually strongly getting ready to close on another brand of boat (one with a lightning bolt on the hull) that will be an upgrade. A 23 foot W/A with full transom brand new Mercury 250 hp and new trailer. The new one also has a hardtop which I currently do not have.

If I happen to "jump ship" I will always have fond memories of the Grady and will always be a supporter of the brand. I'll probably stay on this thread as a former owner because I think this is a really good forum. With a few hiccups here and there, it is full of knowledgeable objective posters who many times are honest about the strength and the shortcomings of the GW brand.

 

[seasick]

The soft deck worries me more than the cracks in the transom. The transom cracks probably do indicate a wet transom, expensive to replace but we know what is entailed. The soft deck on the other hand may be just a soft core of the deck sole or an indication of more extensive issues. There may be ways using an optical borescope to get a look under the deck by removing the panel below the helm and any access plates to scope under the floor. That area is where all the rigging runs.
FYI, the 208s with plastic fuel tanks did not have removable deck lids over the tank. At least my 2001 didn't.

So the decision boils down to one of two approaches. In the first case, you love your boat and really want to keep it and keep it in good shape. You will probably spend more than you would ever recover if you sold it.
In the second case, you do a financial analysis. What is the boat and motor worth in todays market (which appears to be slowing down a bit). What is the motor worth? It may be very little or a lot if newly repowered. Subtract the motor value and you have an estimate of hull value. If the cost of repairs is greater then the hull value, you will take a loss if you plan on selling. Maybe the 'paper' loss is OK for you.

If you want to just get as much use as possible, you need at a minimum to caulk all the cracks and open seams. You can pull the motor and the cap but I suspect you will find wet spots and maybe rot. If the transom is soft or flexes when stressed, the aluminum plate can buy a few years of service. Just live with the soft deck.

 

[steveditt]

Review my posts and pictures this year of my 98 208 transom was replaced this past winter mine had the same cracks for years kept repairing them and each winter would return I didn't see any flexing of the transom once it was opened it was rotten its a big job $7 seems like a good price . Good luck

 

[langski93]

You present an interesting scenario. I am a 96 Adventure owner and while I would never neglect my boat to the point of being detrimental to safety, how much am i going to invest in an almost 30 year old boat that I own?

A 7k dollar transom job is equal to what I purchased my boat for in 2009. I had to repower it as the engine on it had a blown powerhead. but I've always kept it in the back of mind how much is too much to spend on this boat? I've decided that the Grady has been a great boat especially where I used it Cape May and Delaware Bay. I probably would not make the investment if my transom went bad.

I don't think there is a wrong answer to your question. You may decide to replace the transom you may move on as well. Think it out and do what's best for you. If a competent shop says its usable and cosmetic you have peace of mind and could continue to enjoy your boat keeping this issue in the back of your mind but not losing sleep over it. My question is the shop you dealt with said 7K to start. Start what? A transom replacement or repair.? Also a consideration is if you're that happy with the boat (they are great boats) 7k may be a wise investment. It is certainly much less than the roughly 145K price of a new 218.

I have the same cracks you do and I routinely inspect the transom notch to make sure things aren't worsening. Transom sometime go wet on their own. My 28 year old boat with the transom drilled a few times for transducers and a swim ladder probably is a little damp as well. I have already had the fuel tank hatch recoring done and the deck in my boat is rock solid. I have also had all four hatches re glassed and they delaminated again. I guess my point is if my transom went really bad I would probably replace the boat.

I'm actually strongly getting ready to close on another brand of boat (one with a lightning bolt on the hull) that will be an upgrade. A 23 foot W/A with full transom brand new Mercury 250 hp and new trailer. The new one also has a hardtop which I currently do not have.

If I happen to "jump ship" I will always have fond memories of the Grady and will always be a supporter of the brand. I'll probably stay on this thread as a former owner because I think this is a really good forum. With a few hiccups here and there, it is full of knowledgeable objective posters who many times are honest about the strength and the shortcomings of the GW brand.

Thanks for the thoughtful reply. The 7k quote is for a full transom replacement and I agree, if the transom is showing movement I would replace it myself or sell. However, I am in this gray area where any current delam or even rot, appears to be limited to a very small area even if moisture has penetrated there is no movement in the transom. My focus, is the use of aluminium plate sandwich a reasonable approach to reinforce the wet area at the top of the notch (along with new bang plate and top edge sealed) while tying in and reinforcing the rest of the transom. Thanks again, langski

 

[Mustang65fbk]

I know you mentioned you don’t want to sell the boat… that being said, if it were me I’d honestly consider doing so as the boat is now 25 years old. As mentioned, $7k is a fair amount of money on something that likely won’t increase the value of the boat at all.

 

[langski93]

The soft deck worries me more than the cracks in the transom. The transom cracks probably do indicate a wet transom, expensive to replace but we know what is entailed. The soft deck on the other hand may be just a soft core of the deck sole or an indication of more extensive issues. There may be ways using an optical borescope to get a look under the deck by removing the panel below the helm and any access plates to scope under the floor. That area is where all the rigging runs.
FYI, the 208s with plastic fuel tanks did not have removable deck lids over the tank. At least my 2001 didn't.

So the decision boils down to one of two approaches. In the first case, you love your boat and really want to keep it and keep it in good shape. You will probably spend more than you would ever recover if you sold it.
In the second case, you do a financial analysis. What is the boat and motor worth in todays market (which appears to be slowing down a bit). What is the motor worth? It may be very little or a lot if newly repowered. Subtract the motor value and you have an estimate of hull value. If the cost of repairs is greater then the hull value, you will take a loss if you plan on selling. Maybe the 'paper' loss is OK for you.

If you want to just get as much use as possible, you need at a minimum to caulk all the cracks and open seams. You can pull the motor and the cap but I suspect you will find wet spots and maybe rot. If the transom is soft or flexes when stressed, the aluminum plate can buy a few years of service. Just live with the soft deck.

Good morning. Thanks for the reply. I think you last paragraph sums up where I am at. Since I will be doing all the work, I think the aluminium plate may work (I am hoping to hear from someone who has actually done it) given the transom has not shown movement, but there is moisture there. If I find evidence of extensive rot, I will do a full replacement in a conventional way,

 

[langski93]

I know you mentioned you don’t want to sell the boat… that being said, if it were me I’d honestly consider doing so as the boat is now 25 years old. As mentioned, $7k is a fair amount of money on something that likely won’t increase the value of the boat at all.

That is certainly a fair comment and I can't argue with the math. If I use aluminium plates or a conventional full replacement, I will be doing the work myself. I am looking to keep myself on the water and would farm it out under normal circumstances, but recent large expenditures prevent that. On the plus side, I had the OX66 rebuilt several years ago and it runs strong with limited hours. It has been very well maintained.

 

[Mustang65fbk]

That is certainly a fair comment and I can't argue with the math. If I use aluminium plates or a conventional full replacement, I will be doing the work myself. I am looking to keep myself on the water and would farm it out under normal circumstances, but recent large expenditures prevent that. On the plus side, I had the OX66 rebuilt several years ago and it runs strong with limited hours. It has been very well maintained.

I guess I'm a numbers guy and I always think about that in the back of my mind in that if I put xxxx amount of money into something, will it be worth that in the long run when I go to sell it? If you're planning on keeping it for the next 5, 10 or even 15 years then yes... the hull replacement would be a good investment. That being said, if you're planning on selling it or are 50/50 on whether you'll keep the boat for another 5 years... I'd honestly just sell it now, let the next owner deal with it and get something like a 228 Seafarer/232 Gulfstream that has the transom bracket and to where the hull problems are drastically reduced. Just my thoughts and opinions on the matter, of course.

 

[Hookup1]

Your issues are easy to see. You going to have a difficult time selling it or wind up giving it away. The cracking is an indicator that the transom is moving. It likely won't fall off anytime soon but it's working. Is the "soft deck" a hatch or is it the deck?

 

[billyttpd]

After rereading this and realizing what you have for power this plate may be the best course of action. It seems the most cost effective and simplest repair. You will likely get another decade out of the boat

 

[langski93]

Your issues are easy to see. You going to have a difficult time selling it or wind up giving it away. The cracking is an indicator that the transom is moving. It likely won't fall off anytime soon but it's working. Is the "soft deck" a hatch or is it the deck?

Thanks hookup1. I agree and I will have a Viking funeral before I give it away. If I execute a good quality fix, using plates or full on replacement, that boat is worth a lot more to me than to some new boat buyer offering a few thousand dollars, but of course I don't want to throw good $$ after bad. I will probably never be in the position to purchase a well cared for 2nd owner boat again.

Good question about the soft floor. It's located behind the captains chair on starboard side in the sole, not near any hatches. This boat has a solid deck other than the inspection plates. Apparently, when GW added poly tanks hey moved away from the much larger rectangular hatches and essentially made a solid floor. Pluses and minuses on that I guess. I originally thought it was from water getting in under the center inspection plate above the fuel sender, but I had sealed that really well along time ago along with the other plates. I've kept my eye on that plate as that has been opened and closed many times with no sign of degradation. Now I am thinking the ingress is from the plate directly in front of the captains chair and then flowing backwards. I suppose the same can be thought of that center plate also. Though there is a more natural path for water to flow from in front of captains chair to area of damage, since the hull sits slightly elevated in the bow. I'm going to be scouring the net for a Grady (hopefully an overnighter or Adventure) so I can see the layout and techniques used in deck installation and layout.. All The Best
Langski

 

[Hookup1]

You have lots of options!



But seriously - GW used plywood in the deck and hatches. The hatch is easy to repair. Deck not so much. May be able to find someone here that has repaired deck on GG site.

Not sure how handy you are but there is a lot of DIY repair you could do. The finish may not be professional level but the strength could be brought back.

I refurbished my hardtop, painted the aluminum tower, painted the hull, installed a bow thruster. Replacing my transom is on my next year to-do list. I'm not a pro, don't have covered work area, no garage. Between GG site, YouTube videos, lot of research and hard work it came out great.

 

[Hookup1]

My 99 is showing the cracks in the lower corners of the transom notch that is a sign of water entrance that many are familiar with. they are about 1.5 to 2" in length, not bulging and not wide open. I have done the bang test and I can notice such a slight change in sound between the cracks and the close surrounding area, I actually wonder if the sound is truly different. The sound of tapping the rest of the transom gives a good tap and Ring sound along with the bounce of the hammer. I plan on getting a moisture meter on it.

I have had the boat 10 years (?)years as second owner, never painted and kept in very nice condition. Its never been left in the water and always well covered when not used. Minimally, I'm thinking of removing the motor and aluminium trim strip to access the situation and addressing the issues found.

At what point of damage do I replace the whole transom. If damage appears minimal, can it be satisfactorily arrested short of a full transom replacement. I did the work on a Bertram Moppie 20 full transom replacement using coosa, so I am familiar with process and in a weird way kind of liked it. That said, I am not getting any younger though and I would like to use the boat before I die. I called a boat shop with a good reputation and they said $7k to completely replace the transom only, more if they find other issues.

A friend who is very familiar with working on sailboats suggested I look into sistering an aluminum plate on both sides of the transom making it a composite sandwich comprised of gelcoat, fiberglass, Plywood and metal, including zincs all through bolted together. I would still have to seal off the top of the notch, but if the transom is still 90% solid, wouldn't this be an effective solution?

Issue number 2 There is a soft spot on the floor, starboard side, just rear of the captain's chair. It drives me nuts. I cannot access it as the sole only has the small inspection plates, which means I am going to have to cut the section out and probably more. The question is, am I the only Adventure owner that does not have a large removable deck panel above the fuel tank? All floor repairs I have seen on line focus on repairing the panel and reinstalling. Lucky me.

Anyway, its been a great boat, I don't want to sell, it shows well, and just needs some loving. All suggestion, input and ideas are always appreciated.

Langski


port side visible just below manky screw

Starboard and I loosened the screw.

My boat is 25 years old. I did the makeover myself. I couldn't find anyone to do the work and it would have too expensive. This is my last boat. It does everything I want. I'm also fortunate to have the option to fish on some interesting high end boats in places my boat can't get to..

If you did a Coosa board transom you should take that path. Forget the aluminum sandwich - it's only as strong as your current transom. Transom separates from the stringers and cam's it off. Watch the progression of the cracks. You have some life left in it for now. As far as opening the top up and doing some kind of repair is wishful thinking.

You have to try to get under the soft deck and see what is going on.

Good luck!

 

[langski93]

You have lots of options!

View attachment 35005

But seriously - GW used plywood in the deck and hatches. The hatch is easy to repair. Deck not so much. May be able to find someone here that has repaired deck on GG site.

Not sure how handy you are but there is a lot of DIY repair you could do. The finish may not be professional level but the strength could be brought back.

I refurbished my hardtop, painted the aluminum tower, painted the hull, installed a bow thruster. Replacing my transom is on my next year to-do list. I'm not a pro, don't have covered work area, no garage. Between GG site, YouTube videos, lot of research and hard work it came out great.

.
Hey thanks

Review my posts and pictures this year of my 98 208 transom was replaced this past winter mine had the same cracks for years kept repairing them and each winter would return I didn't see any flexing of the transom once it was opened it was rotten its a big job $7 seems like a good price . Good luck

Steveditt
I checked out your pics and conversations you were having. I think I have to get the motor off very soon so I can drill some holes and check more specifically how bad the situation is. I would not be surprised if my winter is going to be spent with the transom,

 

[langski93]

Review my posts and pictures this year of my 98 208 transom was replaced this past winter mine had the same cracks for years kept repairing them and each winter would return I didn't see any flexing of the transom once it was opened it was rotten its a big job $7 seems like a good price . Good luc

You have lots of options!

View attachment 35005

But seriously - GW used plywood in the deck and hatches. The hatch is easy to repair. Deck not so much. May be able to find someone here that has repaired deck on GG site.

Not sure how handy you are but there is a lot of DIY repair you could do. The finish may not be professional level but the strength could be brought back.

I refurbished my hardtop, painted the aluminum tower, painted the hull, installed a bow thruster. Replacing my transom is on my next year to-do list. I'm not a pro, don't have covered work area, no garage. Between GG site, YouTube videos, lot of research and hard work it came out great.

I can have a covered area for a couple of months going forward and given the feedback from others, it may be wise to focus on the deck and get another year out of the transom (with the appropriate band aids) until next year. Honestly I dread opening the deck as I had to do that on the Bertram and that was a nasty scenario which I hoped I would never have to repeat. On top of that my year 208 lacks the long rectangular hatch over the fuel tank that prevents me from getting a good horizontal look at below deck. On the Bert I changed out the transom from within as access was easy,
though the compound curves and transom covering boards were a challenge, but it came out very well. The onboard access to the transom on the Adventure is really limited too. I'm not sure I want to pop the cap or cut out the battery compartment starboard and the oil and water pumps compartment on the port side in order to do the work from the inside. Lots to think about here. Thanks again

 

[seasick]

I can have a covered area for a couple of months going forward and given the feedback from others, it may be wise to focus on the deck and get another year out of the transom (with the appropriate band aids) until next year. Honestly I dread opening the deck as I had to do that on the Bertram and that was a nasty scenario which I hoped I would never have to repeat. On top of that my year 208 lacks the long rectangular hatch over the fuel tank that prevents me from getting a good horizontal look at below deck. On the Bert I changed out the transom from within as access was easy,
though the compound curves and transom covering boards were a challenge, but it came out very well. The onboard access to the transom on the Adventure is really limited too. I'm not sure I want to pop the cap or cut out the battery compartment starboard and the oil and water pumps compartment on the port side in order to do the work from the inside. Lots to think about here. Thanks again

There is very limited access to the inside transom. Even if you cut out stuff to get access, re-glassing what you cut out will be close to impossible. I would inspect the internal areas including stringers as best I could and if there is no obvious rotting, proceed to accessing the transom from the outside Test holes (small ones) can be made from the inside and filled after checking.
Outside holes where transducers are mounted or the garboard drain may help but usually the garboard drain area will be wetter than the rest. I assume you don't see flexing of the transom when you put a load on it. If there is no flex, I am not sure the added plate will make much of a difference. If I don't find rot with the mentioned checks, I might opt to just clean up and reseal the cracks and gaps and of course the cap (but not remove it.
Use sealants/caulks and not adhesives like 4200 or 5200. Do not use silicone.