Has anyone heard good.... bad..... anything.... about the new Evinrude E-Tec motors should I get one? :hmm
To E-TEC or NOT E-TEC that is the question
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Cover the eyes of the innocent. A dead horse is about to be whipped! 
Try a quick search and you will see the good, bad, and ugly!
Try a quick search and you will see the good, bad, and ugly!
I will ride the pony! I believe they are reliable outboards if taken care of. You should have a mechanic check out the motor. If it is in good shape and is selling for a reasonable price, go for it. I have a 1994 evinrude 200 hp and she is still going. Mine is an ocean pro. From what I understand, some of the Evinrude Ficht outboards from the late 90s should be avoided. I am not speaking from personal experience on the Ficht model, just relaying what I have read over the years. I am an evinrude owner, so I really love these motors. For whatever it is worth, when my ocean pro dies, I will be getting a gently used 200 hp E-Tec. Good luck!
E-Tecs in general are not new....they have been on the market for a number of years and I have a number of friends who run them on their Whalers and Gradys. They all love them and have had no problems with them to speak of. That said, like anything everyone has their dock-talk and some personal horror stories to share I am sure. More so, many boaters are "brand blind" not just brand loyal when it comes to outboards...they like what they like and the rest is...well crap in their eyes. Myself, I have owned every make of outboard there is except for a Suzuki. That said they were all good motors if cared for properly and of course, they all had their flaws.
The most important thing I think when considering to purchase an outboard is, What is your local dealer landscape look like? Is there a good local dealer / service provider you trust most? If so, work with them and consider the brands they sell. You will after all likely be dealing with them for MANY years to come.
For me, I would only buy an E-Tec as a repower because locally here in Detroit, I have a very trusted dealer and mechanic that I would want to work with. They are great at consumer service, have great mechanical knowledge, are great dealers and good people too. They only sell Evinrude so, that's what I would get. If there were good Yamaha and Mercury dealers locally, I may consider them as well....but there are not.
The most important thing I think when considering to purchase an outboard is, What is your local dealer landscape look like? Is there a good local dealer / service provider you trust most? If so, work with them and consider the brands they sell. You will after all likely be dealing with them for MANY years to come.
For me, I would only buy an E-Tec as a repower because locally here in Detroit, I have a very trusted dealer and mechanic that I would want to work with. They are great at consumer service, have great mechanical knowledge, are great dealers and good people too. They only sell Evinrude so, that's what I would get. If there were good Yamaha and Mercury dealers locally, I may consider them as well....but there are not.
I've had a 250 Etec for almost 7 years and love it. I'm selling my Gulstream now now because I now longer need a cuddy and am in the process of buying a Freedon 225. If given a choice, I'd rather have an ETec on the Freedom rather than the Yamaha 250. The Yamahas, even the newer 4.2L, are just too heavy. The stern scuppers are either underwater or half way under. That shouldn't be, but is a reality with the heavy Yamaha. If you buy an Etec, you won't be disappointed.
Thanks guys.....I think that anything that is mass produced....the first ones out of the mold are great.....the longer you use the mold.....eventually you're going to have ones that have some problems.....or put another way...."anything made by human hands is bound to have screw ups"....you get some really good ones and some really bad ones but for the most part most are O.K. :mrgreen:
I repowered a few months ago. Replaced a 225 Jonhson with a 300 HP E-Tec.
The Johnson was great but loved fuel and a little hard to start. The new motor just touch the key and it is running.
What I like is the 300 hr or 3 year no maintenance.
The Johnson was great but loved fuel and a little hard to start. The new motor just touch the key and it is running.
What I like is the 300 hr or 3 year no maintenance.
I just bought a 1994 Sailfish 252 with a pair of 2006 E-TEC 200 HO engines. I fired them up yesterday and did the automatic fogging procedure - cool. I haven't really run them other then the seatrial and the boat ran up to 40 MPH in a short stretch without difficulty. That was on a choppy day with the canvas up and with no attempt to trim it out so it may go faster. I'm not a WOT kind of guy but just did the test to check the RPMs. The previous owner provided the service history and there were no problems noted. Like this forum, the folks at the http://www.etecownersgroup.com/ were very helpful answering all my questions and addressing my concerns.
The key selling point for me was how quite and clean these outboards are. My wife hated my my old 1990 Yamaha 225 so much that the last time she came along she said "this is the last time I'm going out on this boat." She was getting headache from the noise and fumes. She insisted I buy an I/O like my two previous ones and I came very close to pulling the trigger on a 1992 254 in Buffalo until I found this E-TEC boat in North Carolina.
How quiet are they? Powerboat Reports did a study that compared 6 outboards (both 2 and 4 strokes) and found that at cruising speed, where it counts the most, the E-TEC was the quietest...! At idle, the 4-strokes are the quieter but who cares - they are all quiet at idle. At WOT, the Honda was the quietest and the E-TEC came in 3rd out of the 6 for noise; however, the E-TEC was fastest of the group at 6 MPH faster then the Honda and 3.5 MPH faster then the Yamaha F150 (which was the loudest at WOT). I found the study results here:
http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/sho ... -dB-levels
If you are considering used ones, make sure to have someone connect a computer to the engine to download the history report which will show the RPM and temperature history and a list of all the faults that occurred as well as the engine hours. An example 3-page history report is shown here:
http://www.etecownersgroup.com/post/His ... ory+report
You can upload the history report to that site and experineced owners and mechanics will provide guidance.
I paid a mechanic ~$170 do the compression tests and read the histories before my purchase. I have since bought the software and cable to due this myself on Ebay for ~$200 and it works fine.
Cheers,
-Scott
The key selling point for me was how quite and clean these outboards are. My wife hated my my old 1990 Yamaha 225 so much that the last time she came along she said "this is the last time I'm going out on this boat." She was getting headache from the noise and fumes. She insisted I buy an I/O like my two previous ones and I came very close to pulling the trigger on a 1992 254 in Buffalo until I found this E-TEC boat in North Carolina.
How quiet are they? Powerboat Reports did a study that compared 6 outboards (both 2 and 4 strokes) and found that at cruising speed, where it counts the most, the E-TEC was the quietest...! At idle, the 4-strokes are the quieter but who cares - they are all quiet at idle. At WOT, the Honda was the quietest and the E-TEC came in 3rd out of the 6 for noise; however, the E-TEC was fastest of the group at 6 MPH faster then the Honda and 3.5 MPH faster then the Yamaha F150 (which was the loudest at WOT). I found the study results here:
http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/sho ... -dB-levels
If you are considering used ones, make sure to have someone connect a computer to the engine to download the history report which will show the RPM and temperature history and a list of all the faults that occurred as well as the engine hours. An example 3-page history report is shown here:
http://www.etecownersgroup.com/post/His ... ory+report
You can upload the history report to that site and experineced owners and mechanics will provide guidance.
I paid a mechanic ~$170 do the compression tests and read the histories before my purchase. I have since bought the software and cable to due this myself on Ebay for ~$200 and it works fine.
Cheers,
-Scott
Great post! :dance Very well thought out and informative. I have owned Evinrude and Yamaha outboards. Both great motors. When the ole ocean pro goes, I will definitely repower with an e-tech. Good luck on your repower :mrgreen: can't go wrong as long as you get the motor checked out.
I have also heard good reports from any E-tec owners I have talked to.
I will be interested to hear of their longevity once they've been around a few more years. I know Yamaha owners with 1000 or more hours and they still run perfectly. They also tell me other stories of Yamahas with more than 2500 hours, owned by commercial fishermen, I would imagine.
I would only repower with Yamaha, because they have been extremely reliable for me. I am glad, however that E-tec is giving some competition,(which is always good) in the Marine marketplace. Plus, it gives owners another alternative, which is also good.
I will be interested to hear of their longevity once they've been around a few more years. I know Yamaha owners with 1000 or more hours and they still run perfectly. They also tell me other stories of Yamahas with more than 2500 hours, owned by commercial fishermen, I would imagine.
I would only repower with Yamaha, because they have been extremely reliable for me. I am glad, however that E-tec is giving some competition,(which is always good) in the Marine marketplace. Plus, it gives owners another alternative, which is also good.
magicalbill said:
You are correct, check out these reports of 4Ss getting 4100 hours on Yamahas, 5000 and 6500 hours on Suzukis, 6500 and 7500 hours on Honda 4Ss.
http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-for ... lol-2.html
And this: "I take care of several 2002-2004 Yamaha F225's with over 8000 hrs on them, 2 charter boats with same F225's 4500-5000hrs, F115 and F150's 3500hrs plus".
http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-for ... ers-2.html
The etecs get nowhere near these many hours. No wonder there are over two dozen salt water fishing boat manufacturers that install 4Ss exclusively, and not even one salt water fishing boat builder that offers only the etec on the boats they build.
If you want an engine that will last the longest, the evidence is overwhelming that a 4S is best.
Hey SoutheastFl;
Interesting you mention 4-strokes lasting the longest;
When I bought my Gulfstream, I had heard talk that the HDPI's were among the best Yamaha made and I wanted to power my Gulfstream with them. My selling dealer talked me out of it, saying that the 4-strokes never came back to the service dept. with any problems and the 2-strokes always did. I took his word and got 200 4-stroke Yams and (knock on wood) they have been absolutely flawless for 380 hrs. Best engines I've ever owned, hands down.
I might also mention, I wanted the engines, cable and wiring factory rigged by Grady, and they stopped offering two stroke engines on their boats at that time. Therefore, to get the factory rigging and installation, I had to get the 4's. I'm extremely glad I did.
Interesting you mention 4-strokes lasting the longest;
When I bought my Gulfstream, I had heard talk that the HDPI's were among the best Yamaha made and I wanted to power my Gulfstream with them. My selling dealer talked me out of it, saying that the 4-strokes never came back to the service dept. with any problems and the 2-strokes always did. I took his word and got 200 4-stroke Yams and (knock on wood) they have been absolutely flawless for 380 hrs. Best engines I've ever owned, hands down.
I might also mention, I wanted the engines, cable and wiring factory rigged by Grady, and they stopped offering two stroke engines on their boats at that time. Therefore, to get the factory rigging and installation, I had to get the 4's. I'm extremely glad I did.
I'll contribute to the horse whipping, see:
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=18523
for the most recent abuse.
I re-powered with a 2006 250hp E-TEC two years ago when my '94 Johnson gave up. I haven't put a lot of hours on it yet, but I love it so far and have some friends down south that run theirs harder with no complaints.
You'll also see the 4S vs 2S argument on the other posts - just as above. I have nothing to add there other than if you started with a 2S and are re-powering, E-TEC is worth a look based on weight.
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=18523
for the most recent abuse.
I re-powered with a 2006 250hp E-TEC two years ago when my '94 Johnson gave up. I haven't put a lot of hours on it yet, but I love it so far and have some friends down south that run theirs harder with no complaints.
You'll also see the 4S vs 2S argument on the other posts - just as above. I have nothing to add there other than if you started with a 2S and are re-powering, E-TEC is worth a look based on weight.
Weight wise the new 4 cyl F-200 seems to be a viable solution but the "old" 2 strokes still do the job. Yes if you're a charter capt or commercial you'll get 3-5000 hours on a 4 stroke but for the average person that uses it about 100 hours a year it'll never happen. You should get at least 1000 hours on ANY new motor and after 10 years you'll be looking for a new one no matter 2 stroke or 4 stroke. How many times do people say motors with over 700 hours are "old", even 4 strokes?
There are additional benefits that 4Ss have over the etec too, the 4Ss get significantly better fuel economy than the etec.
Check out these two tests, the first one a testimonial from an Intrepid owner that repowered from triple etec 250s ( where he blew two lower units on ) to triple Verado 300s. Even with a 50 hp per engine increase the 4Ss still used ALOT less fuel.
Triple Verado 300 4S: Cruise speed 37 kts. And getting 1.1 to 1.2 mpg that is with 4 people onboard and approx 200 gallons of fuel. Top speed of 57.3 kts.
Triple etec 250 2S: Previous cruise was approx 33 kts and getting .7 to .8mpg plus adding the XD 100 oil which burnt about 1 gallon per hr at cruise. Top speed 49 kts.
According to the figures above if you do the math, the Verado 300s are burning 37 gph at cruise and the etec 250s over 50 gph. The Verados are using 13 gph less of gas and yet still going over 4 mph faster, plus saving a gallon per hour of the expensive 2S oil.
If you figure fuel on the water costs $ 4.50 a gallon ( as of this writing ) then the etecs are costing you nearly $ 60 an hour more for gas plus at least $ 35 + an hour for the 2S oil.
Bottom line: The etecs cost nearly $ 100 a hour MORE than the Verados to operate at cruise.
http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-for ... ury-3.html
And a single 4S gets better fuel economy that a single etec as well. This test shows that a Mercury Verado 150 hp used 2 1/2 gph less fuel than the etec 150 at cruise, saving over $ 11 per hour. Also in both 0-20 mph & 0-30 mph accleration tests, the Mercury Verado 150 hp out-performed the etec. And in head-to-head testing, the Mercury Verado 150 hp had the highest top speed vs. the etec as well.
http://www.mercurymarine.com/engines/en ... 2466370416
Check out these two tests, the first one a testimonial from an Intrepid owner that repowered from triple etec 250s ( where he blew two lower units on ) to triple Verado 300s. Even with a 50 hp per engine increase the 4Ss still used ALOT less fuel.
Triple Verado 300 4S: Cruise speed 37 kts. And getting 1.1 to 1.2 mpg that is with 4 people onboard and approx 200 gallons of fuel. Top speed of 57.3 kts.
Triple etec 250 2S: Previous cruise was approx 33 kts and getting .7 to .8mpg plus adding the XD 100 oil which burnt about 1 gallon per hr at cruise. Top speed 49 kts.
According to the figures above if you do the math, the Verado 300s are burning 37 gph at cruise and the etec 250s over 50 gph. The Verados are using 13 gph less of gas and yet still going over 4 mph faster, plus saving a gallon per hour of the expensive 2S oil.
If you figure fuel on the water costs $ 4.50 a gallon ( as of this writing ) then the etecs are costing you nearly $ 60 an hour more for gas plus at least $ 35 + an hour for the 2S oil.
Bottom line: The etecs cost nearly $ 100 a hour MORE than the Verados to operate at cruise.
http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-for ... ury-3.html
And a single 4S gets better fuel economy that a single etec as well. This test shows that a Mercury Verado 150 hp used 2 1/2 gph less fuel than the etec 150 at cruise, saving over $ 11 per hour. Also in both 0-20 mph & 0-30 mph accleration tests, the Mercury Verado 150 hp out-performed the etec. And in head-to-head testing, the Mercury Verado 150 hp had the highest top speed vs. the etec as well.
http://www.mercurymarine.com/engines/en ... 2466370416
I wouldn't trust someone telling me the time on thehulltruth let alone actual performance numbers. Plus I'm sure if you go to Yami's page or Honda's page or Zuke's page you'll see data showing their motors on top.
I have yet to see any 4 stroke match the low end power of a 2 stroke, I can't verify but the Verado is probably closest because of the forced induction. The price you pay is increased fuel consumption, especially at idle.
I have yet to see any 4 stroke match the low end power of a 2 stroke, I can't verify but the Verado is probably closest because of the forced induction. The price you pay is increased fuel consumption, especially at idle.
Grog said:
You not going to "trust" the word of one of the most successful boat brokers in the country too, namely GreatGrady's own Anglers Edge Marine ? He sells over 700 boats a year and knows what boaters truly want in an outboard engine.
Maybe you need to be reminded of his comments regarding etecs:
"E-tec's are just miserable on resale. Nobody wants a two stroke anymore."
http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-for ... e-tec.html
"The best thing BRP has developed is their marketing department. The reality is that a very very very small percentage of buyers want an e-tec. About 95% of buyers want a 4 stroke. E-tec is normally the kiss of death on resale."
http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-for ... ed-11.html
"I personally take into consideration is resale value as well as how easy the boat will be to sell later. I can tell you that your resale will be better with a 4 stroke. From my experience probably close to 90% of the buyers out there are looking for 4 stroke power."
http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-for ... oke-2.html
"As far as resale goes though everyone wants a four stoke. Just the way it is today. You can hang a big beautiful set of boobs on a two stroke and it's still not gonna sell like a 4 stroke.
I hear this everyday: "I really love the boat, it has everything I want but I really don't want those two strokes"
I have never heard this though: "I really love the boat, it has everything I want but I really didn't want those four strokes"
"In order these are the easiest engines for resale:
1) Yamaha four strokes
2) Suzuki four strokes
3) Honda four strokes
4) Yamaha HPDI
5) Mercury 4 strokes
6) Mercury Optimax
7) Evinrude Etec
8) Yamaha OX66
9) Johnson and Evinrude OMC pre Etec
Again, this is not my personal opinion but based on what I see. Selling 700+ boats a year will give you a pretty good idea."
http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-for ... ami-5.html
I repowered my Grady Voyager with a 300 E-tec and love it. There was several factors in my choice and one was weight.
When repowering older boats the weight of the 4 stroke is an issue that should be considered.
When repowering older boats the weight of the 4 stroke is an issue that should be considered.
SoutheastFl's first post was somewhat tempered. The second post, well.....guess you drank the koolaid on the 4 stroke. Resale on a boat greater because of 4 stroke? Ok, if you say so. The reality is, the boat is not an "investment." You may have a hard time selling it whether it has a 4 stroke, or 2 stroke. I agree with the posts regarding the weight of the motor. That will be a factor, to be sure. Also, in terms of torque and hole shot, the 4 stroke will never be able to compete with the 2 stroke. I have owned yamaha and evinrude, so I am not tied to any specific brand. Forget the voodoo logic. Try out a 2 stroke and a 4 stroke and see what you prefer. I prefer 2 stroke. Don't know why. I also prefer 2 stroke dirt bikes, as opposed to 4 stroke. Guess I just like the smoke, noise and torque. I also Currently own a 1994 looper, Evinrude Ocean Pro. The difference between me and a new 4 stroke owner is that I have 15k more in my pocket. But i guess the ocean pro is a piece of garbage. I can live with that. The motor has been jamming for almost 20 years. Buy whatever you feel comfortable with. I would be wary about the hype. Either type of motor will be just fine.
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