20' Overnighter Repower

[jtsailjt]

Hi all, I'm new to this site and have tried the search function in an attempt to answer my question but still have ?????'s and am thinking there's some old Grady hand out there who can tell me just what I want to know.

I have a "vintage" (1978) 204 Overnighter that's still in great shape, and I really want to keep it so need to repower. For those who are unfamiliar, it's one of those with fake lapstrakes (that I like) and is beige/brown in color and it has the notch in the transom. I've got a friend who's an expert at fiberglass and last fall I removed the old motor and scuppers and everything else bolted to the transom and had him check it out (some moisture but not rotted) and thoroughly dry it and fill every hole in it as well as 3 layers of glass around the top of the transom (to seal the deck/hull joint) and re-gelcoat it. I plan to use a 25" shaft Mercury outboard (I know an awesome and reasonably priced mechanic who prefers working on mercs) so to accommodate the longer shaft, will add a 5" transom jack to mount the new motor on. I have it set up with 2 batteries, one on each side under the aft seats, and a 15hp, 4 stroke kicker on the port side. I use the boat primarily for fishing day trips with 2 or 3 people aboard, but occasionally for water skiing (kicker removed) with a crowd aboard too. I live in Maine so we have a short season and I only put about 250 gallons of gasoline through it a year with the old motor. I'd plan to keep the boat indefinitely (I'm 53) I'd like to avoid adding trim tabs. When I bought it, it had a very old, now deceased, 235hp Evinrude on the transom. That's about all the pertinent info I can think of, so.......

....now for my question. How heavy (in pounds) an outboard can I get away with, or would you recommend, considering all the above, as well as the scupper locations? The 3 liter Opti's (Merc's 2 stroke direct injected 2 stroke) in 200 or 225 hp are a little over 500#'s, and the 175 Opti weighs in at about 430#. All the Verado's (4 strokes) in 175 and above are also over 500#. The third option is about a 7 year old EFI 2 stroke and those are all under 500#, even up to 225hp, with the 175hp EFI around 420#. I don't want to go below 175hp. I realize that not many of you are real familiar with boats as old as mine, but the scuppers seem to be about the same height as most other Grady's I've seen. The boat is currently in storage and I don't have the option of "trying on" various weight motors and putting it in the water to see how it sits, etc. There are lots of used Opti's out there and they get great gas mileage so are tempting, especially if I could find a 175XL. The only 4 stroke that's even a possibility is the 175hp, with the larger ones being very heavy. The EFI's get worse mileage and pollute more, but weigh less. So, which used motor should I buy?

Note: I'm familiar with the Opti '00-'02 "issues." Don't have anything against any other brand outboards, but want to stick with Merc.

I'd love to hear from any of you, especially older 20' Overnighter owners, who may have recently faced this same decision, what's the heaviest motor you'd be comfortable running on your/my boat and what are your thoughts? Thanks in advance!

 

[Doc Stressor]

I think that the 175 opti would be your best bet. They are fuel efficient as well as light.

I had a new 1975 204C years ago, so I'm familiar with the hull. I repowered twice over the 11 years that I owned the boat. I always used 135-140 hp engines because of the weight issue. They were a little squishy for that boat, but I rode in several identical boats with 150-200 hp 2-strokes that weighed over 400 lb and I didn't like the squat. You need trim tabs with the heavier engines. Since that hull is wet and will pound pretty bad in a head sea, using the tabs to keep the bow down is limited.

The 204C planes more easily than the SV2 208. 175 hp is all that you will need to move along as fast as you will want to go with that hull.

 

[Renegade]

I have an 83 204c with a 200 Johnson on it and the scuppers are high enough with it. My hull is rated for like 235hp, so whatever a 83 235 hp outboard weighs would be your max weight I would think.

 

[Parthery]

Welcome to the forum...

I would think a Yamaha F150 or a 150 E-Tec would be the way to go, but if you have your heart set on a Merc, then a 175 Optimax would work.

If you are searching for a late model or new motor, why not look for something with a 20" shaft? Save the money on the jackplate and maybe get a newer (or even brand new) motor.

 

[jtsailjt]

Thanks for the comments, all. I do think the 175 Opti might be the ideal engine for me and anything bigger would have more negatives than positives.


The reason I'd like to use the transom jack is because the 20" engine sits so low to the water, and unless I slowed down very gradually, water would get in the exhaust and sometimes make it sputter. Also, when fishing with a following sea and a couple of fairly heavy fishermen in the back, sometimes a wave would splash well up against the engine cowling. That never caused a problem but raising things up by 5" seemed like it would give the engine a little more breathing room. The manual transom jack is only about $300 and would allow me to keep the powerhead 5 more inches above the water. Also, my mechanic says that setting the motor back 5" will help performance a little.

Great site, lots of great information/experience here!!

 

[jtsailjt]

As I mentioned before, it does sound like the 175 Opti might be just about right and that's probably what I'll end up with, but I wonder if there's anybody out there who's actually mounted one of the 3 liter Opti's (200 or 225hp), or a 4 stroke that weighs over 500# on the 204 Overnighter, and what was your experience with it? There seems to be lots of these heavier motors available used, but not many of the 175's.

 

[wanderer200]

I had a 77 204 ctr console. Originally it had an 83 200 evinrude (rated for 235) and single battery. No complaints except for the low, open back like yours. I repowered with a 01 200 rude with a 25 inch shaft and lift plates to raise the 5 inches. Just that alone and it sat 2 inches lower in the water. Water would come in the scuppers if 2 of us stood it the back and made the low transom even worse. I made some block-off plates out of starboard that helped with the water coming in over the back. It also did not ride as good with the extra weight either. If I had it to do over , I would have looked for a 20 inch. YMMV as you have more weight forward with the cuddy than I did with the ctr console.
I still have the lift plates made by pro-lift if your interested.

 

[jtsailjt]

Thanks wanderer, your boat must have been very similar to mine and it sounds like exactly what I am afraid would happen if I tried to put a 3 liter Opti on my boat. I looked up your 200 hp rude and it said the thing weighed in at just over 500# so that sort of reconfirms that I should try to keep my motor weight down closer to 400# or so.

I appreciate your jack plate offer and tried to look up Pro Lift lift plates so I could get an idea of what yours looked like, but couldn't find that brand. I did find a CMC brand that makes a "PL" series of jacks. Do you know what model your is so I could get a better idea of what it is? If you want to email me with pix or any other info, my email is jefftotman@aol.com Thanks

 

[wanderer200]

I will take some pics and send to you later tonite.

 

[BUZZCUDA]

I have an 86 that repowered with fourstroke suzuki 150. Yes it does squat and the scuppers sit just about 1/2 under while at rest. I have had it in some snot both backing down and drifting. I am pleased with the performance and have no regrets.

 

[BUZZCUDA]

Oh I almost forgot.
Lets say we compare weight of the e tec 150 vs four stroke suzuki that weighs 478 lbs the e tec is 418 lbs for a 20" shaft or a 433 for a 25" that is what you should need. You are only talking about 63 lbs vs 44 lbs. difference.
I never get what everyones weight concern is. We are screwed with the unavailable old school 2 stroke choices that weighd in at not much more than 380 lbs for a 225 any brand. The whole power to weight ratio is what is usually debated. My 20 foot overnighter gets up to 38 mph and I can rarely get it up and keep there in slight chop if I still want my teeth. Of course conditions, load, etc.
Just check your older version grady.

 

[bdevlin5983]

I went with the E-Tec on my 86 204C... Went with the 225 though, as I got a great deal, and the wieght is not much different than the 200.

I have a few friends with older boats that have done the E-Tec, all are happy with it, as am I. I also have a few friends who have done the Yammy 4S and found the weight to be too much. The Suzuki seems to be a good middleground with weight, and definitely has all the benfits of a 4S. IMHO and experience though, the 150 4S's are more like a 120 2S as far as torque and performance.

I also went with the E-Tec because there is very little added weight, and no compromise on torque. Also, I find the fuel consumption to be very comparable to the 4S, but your experience may vary.

Bren

 

[BUZZCUDA]

I did look at the e tech and had no objection to it. At the time I did not have the extra dollars for the e tec and I too had to make a decision based upon price and what I think is a good deal for the df 150 suzuki. I would like to have gone with the 175 but also new that for me and my use the 150 would do fine.
If I recall the e tech was about 3500 more including the rigging. That and Iam also a fan of suzukis, having a 150 2 stroke still on my mako and had a 75 on a skiff before that.I have never been in a situation where I said damn, I wish I had more power on my Grady. Suzuki has more displacement and higher gear ratio to swing a larger prop, as compared to other four strokes or even the e tec. Not saying Suzi is better than brand xyz. They are all debatable as each mfg does things different.
I would definatly do e tec and look at it first long and hard. Even yamaha still makes a hpdi motor that is up your alley, i think :roll:
Either way ask each dealer and even call Grady. Do your homework and educate yourself, as you have done already just by being here. Lots of great advice and good people to learn from.

 

[jtsailjt]

Thanks for the discussion, lots of great info. I've got a good friend who has a Suzi 175 4 on his 20' whaler and loves it. Nice motor. I've heard the same about the newer etechs. But I've found that a big part of boating happiness lies in having a mechanic you can totally trust and who works for a reasonable price without making you wait a month in summertime for him to get around to looking at your boat. My mechanic prefers mercs so I really want to stick with that brand because I know he'll take great care of it for me and it won't cost me an arm and a leg.

I really wish I could talk myself into one of the 3 liter (200 or 225) Opti's (there's a couple of them available locally for not much money) but it seems like anything over 500# is just too much weight. The get up and go, and higher top speed would be great, but I don't want to have to get trim tabs and I don't want to get my feet wet every time I step back towards the stern with anybody else back there too. I spend LOTS more time fishing than I do going all out or pulling water skiers. So, it seems like my best bet would be to find either a 175 Opti, or as second choice, an EFI 200hp merc.

Thanks for all the input.

 

[BobP]

200 HPDI, Yamaha has been wanting to kill that motor for 9 years straight, still can't match it with anything else Yamaha manufactures.
Mine ar enot for sale!

ETEC small block 200 also.

If you want 4 stroke, Suzie 175 4 cylinder - nothing else available 4 stroke, except smaller in the F150.

Bot the 4 stroke motors will have noticably less holw shot and top end, particularly hole shot since most don't WOT anyway.

 

[Bigfoot]

1990 204c 200 Ym 4stroke - love it!

 

[jtsailjt]

1990 204c 200 Ym 4stroke - love it!

I just checked the NADA online guide and according to it, Yamaha didn't make a 4 stroke motor that big until 2002. Could your 200hp motor be the 2 stroke that weighed just over 400# or is it really a post 2001 4 stroke that weighs about 460# (475 for XL)? If it's the 4 stroke, how does it sit in the water relative to the scuppers? Thanks.

 

[sfc2113]

I currently have a 175 hp evinrude, and that is more than enough power for this boat. Am planning on repowering with 175 e-tec evinrude next year.