2006 283 release water in fuel

[andystratts]

Hey all,
Hoping your collective experience can help me!
My 283 has experienced water in the fuel tank three times in last two years always after a major rain event followed by her sitting for a couple weeks waiting for wind to lay down
Each time I would be fine until a half mile from home she would die... Each time I would replace both water filters and limp home, then pull the sender and siphon lots of water from the bottom of the tank. I am talking twenty to thirty gallons of contaminated fuel when tank has always well over 100
After purging the water and changing all the filters she is ok till the next major rain fall
The second time it happened, I thought I found the problem as a torn sending unit gasket.
Each time it happened, the top of the fuel tank was soaked with fresh water. I never Lose fuel, I never smell gas.
This last time, I checked the rear bilge after the storm, it was dry. Then when I turned the batteries on the fwd bilge ran strong for thirty seconds

Ident that supposed to run regardless of battery position?. Is it possible the fuel rank is getting flooded midship when it rains? Or am I ending my season early to pull the rank

Help!

 

[DennisG01]

I hope you're at least using a good additive like Startron.

Have you checked the fuel fill for leaking?

How is water getting on top of the tank? Is the floor panel or deck plate not sealed/sealing well?

 

[seasick]

I hope you're at least using a good additive like Startron.

Have you checked the fuel fill for leaking?

How is water getting on top of the tank? Is the floor panel or deck plate not sealed/sealing well?

I do not know if that model has a combo fill/vent fitting but if it does, the first place to look is the o-ring on the fill cap.

If the sender were leaking water I would expect it to also leak fuel when the tank is full.
If the bilge where the tank is located is filling with water, there may be a leak in the vent hose or fitting that lets water in. If the fill hose had a leak, I would again expect to see a fuel leak.
The aft bilge pump will( should work) with the battery switch on or off. I am not sure if the forward bilge pump is automatic.
There is also the ugly possibility of a hole in the tank or a leaky fitting.
Let us know what you find.
good luck.

 

[andystratts]

OK. To answer the points made

Yes. Always an additive at every fill up I use gas shock as reccomended by my well trusted Yamaha certified mechanic
The fuel fill cap and oring are perfect
The vent hose and fill hose are both port side and tight
The deck access covers seem fine. O rings intact and secure fit
After the rainstorms, the top of the tank literally has puddles on it
I reviewed the wiring diagram last night and it appears both bilge pumps should be constant hot
Going to call the dealer today
Any advice would be appreciated!
Thanks

 

[seasick]

OK. To answer the points made

Yes. Always an additive at every fill up I use gas shock as reccomended by my well trusted Yamaha certified mechanic
The fuel fill cap and oring are perfect
The vent hose and fill hose are both port side and tight
The deck access covers seem fine. O rings intact and secure fit
After the rainstorms, the top of the tank literally has puddles on it
I reviewed the wiring diagram last night and it appears both bilge pumps should be constant hot
Going to call the dealer today
Any advice would be appreciated!
Thanks

If you fill the tank and then open the access plates, do you smell gas?
The fact that the tank has puddles on it says that water is getting in the tank area but doesn't explain how it is entering the tank. If the tank has a leak, I would expect the smell of gas.
Note that unless the bilge completely fills up, the top of the tank shouldn't be under water.
There may be a way that water is entering the forward bilge and not draining out all the way to the rear and therefore filling up the tank compartment. The forward bilge would also probably have to be not working AND there still has to be a way for the water to enter the tank.

Perhaps the next time it rains hard, you should try to be on the boat and see if you can locate the entry spot by checking lockers and bilges. It would also help to note how often the bilge pumps cycle.

 

[DennisG01]

If you're positive about the o-ring seals on the fuel fill, then good. But don't base it just on looks. If there's any doubt, change them. Or, at least tape over the fuel fill so it eliminates that as a variable. Now, it is possible that the puddles you see on the tank are from condensation - if that area is getting very wet, then the moisture rises to the underside of the hatch, then drops onto the tank. But, you still need to figure out why so much water is getting in there. There must be leak somewhere that you're either overlooking or haven't thought of.

The deck hatch seal and deck plate are easy to check since you can use on a hose on them.

Seasick brings up a good point about double checking the surface of the tank for pinholes or other points of entry that the water sitting on top of the tank could enter the tank. However, I find it hard to believe that condensation could account for the amount of water you're finding.

Maybe what you should do is pressurize the tank to check/listen for leaks. I would probably try and do the pressurization through the vent since everything else should be sealed. You only need a couple of pounds of air for this, so don't go crazy. I'm thinking this might be the most direct way to locate the entry point.

 

[Harpoon]

I had this exact same scenario happen on a 25 Parker. The Sheeting action of the water somehow flowed directly into my vent. In my case the solution was a flush mounted fuel vent, I think manufactured by Gemlux.

Water does NOT compress and can be devastating if it gets into your engines. As well, it will screw up your injectors. You need that issue resolved in a hurry.

??? why are you getting water puddle on the top of your tank ? Your deck must need to be re-sealed. Freshwater shouldn't be an issue (probably a good thing) on your aluminum tank. You may also want to be sure your sending unit is tight (don't strip screws) and that the gasket is nice and snug.

 

[Sharkbait282]

"The deck access covers seem fine. O rings intact and secure fit"

Take out all the screws and lift an edge of those deck plates. On our 2002 282, the plates fit well with O-rings that were intact and secure, but when we removed the screws, it was immediately evident that the bonding/seal was long since broken. Since these are typically immediately above the sending unit and the fill/vent hose connections on the tank, they're the obvious suspects here.

Even the best silicone or bedding compound is going to break down more quickly than anywhere else on the boat given the constant foot traffic that the cockpit deck plates receive.

When re-seating (anything) in new compound, be sure to NOT screw down tightly until after a day or two of curing, so that there's a more substantial bead of material once you do put a bit more pressure on with the screws. Many times hardware will have next to no bedding compound under a piece of hardware because during installation the fasteners were snugged up all the way, immediately pressing out most or all of the compound meant to create a water tight bond with the new piece of hardware.

 

[andystratts]

Hey all,
Many thanks for the replies so far. Here is the update:

First I checked the forward bilge pump. It has power and ground all the time and demand power with switch activated. Using a garden hose I accessed the area by the pump and flooded the bilge. The pump activated as it should
I then contacted Madaket Marine in Nantucket where I purchased the boat ( by the way, an awesome Grady dealer who will always spend the time for you as needed)
He told me that Grady recommends replacing the deck plates every 5 years and even though they seem fine we're most likely the cause of the water on the top of the tank. He further told me that Grady states every year to apply salt away and flush the top of the tank and leave the deck plates open over the winter as part if the storage process.
He could only offer the same advice we have discussed so far here regarding fuel entry
My next step is to fabricate a air pressure gauge to a Schrader valve and to remove the vent hose and attach it via a short hose to the vent inlet nipple. I figure if I leave all other hoses on I will not only pressurize the tank but also the fill hose and gas cap as well. I am thinking no more than 3 psi?
I really don't think it is the tank due to its age and no I never smell gas fumes in the bilge or see fuel in the bilge
Thoughts?

Thanks all!

 

[DennisG01]

I agree that it is "unlikely" the tank, but don't completely rule it out. Just like the deck plate - you initially were ruling it out but the plate is a likely culprit. Who knows, maybe there's a defect in the tank or the sender gasket. Yes, 3psi is fine - or at least from my experience doing this it'll be plenty. Make sure you do this in a quiet area.

 

[seasick]

I agree that it is "unlikely" the tank, but don't completely rule it out. Just like the deck plate - you initially were ruling it out but the plate is a likely culprit. Who knows, maybe there's a defect in the tank or the sender gasket. Yes, 3psi is fine - or at least from my experience doing this it'll be plenty. Make sure you do this in a quiet area.

Let's assume that the water on the tank is not the cause of water in the tank. Let's also assume that the tank does not have a leak since fumes are not noticed.
What's left? Fuel fill/vent perhaps. Also check the fuel fill fitting itself. The oring may be good but the fitting itself could be leaking although I have never actually seen that situation.

If possible and it may not be easy at all, disconnect the fill and vent hoses at the tank and then run a heavy flow of water over the fill fitting. If water comes out of any hoses, then the fill is leaking somehow.

3 pounds of air is plenty. I would go for 1 or two. The amount of force on the tank walls at 3 lbs is substantial.

 

[Parthery]

I had the same issue with a late 90s 225 Tournament that I once owned...

Water was getting past the fill cap...and yes - the o ring looked good.

Rather then mess with the o-ring, I replaced the entire cap/vent unit and also added the plastic shim which GW began installing somewhere around 2000 or so. This fixed the problem.

Had to pump the tank as well...this is what came out....

 

[andystratts]

Hey folks,

Final(hopefully) follow up on water issue. I purchased 4 new deck plates, Grady caulk, and another seal kit for the sender. I desalted the tank, and installed the new plates. Thanks for the curing the caulk a while tip. I laid a nice bead and waited an hour to fully lock the screws down. You guys were right, the old sealant was literally non existent.
Again,new had recent heavy rains here and the top of the tank was soaked under the old plates. I am hoping this does it but time will tell.
This is a one step at a time process for sure.
Again, many thanks to you all. This forum is awesome.

 

[BobP]

On this center console model, is the console above the tanks? If so what penetrations leave the bottom of the console? How is the console fastened to the deck?

The 283 has the Sailfish hull, is there one or two tanks in the 2006?