AC Control Box for Fischer Panda Genset

[Meanwhile]

I'm trying to run down an issue with my FP diesel genset. I'm looking to find where the AC control box was installed on a 2007 Marlin. I don't recall seeing it. I'd like to check the capacitors.

My issue was starting a Genset after it sat so long while work was done on the boat. The panel lit up and I pressed start after turning on cooling water. The genset turned over a time or 2 but then the panel went dark. I checked the 25amp blade fuse and it was burnt out. I used power to activate the relays and then clicked, and when powered I had continuity on the other 2 blades. I think the relays are OK.

I'm replacing the fuel pump as it was severely corroded, I'm guessing the genetic didn't receive a signal from the fuel pump and shut down.

However, the panel refuses to light up at all after replacing the 25A fuse and checking the K1 & K3 relays.

So the original question, where is the AC control box installed on a 2007 Marlin?

 

[Fishtales]

Don't know if it helps but I had to replace the starter on my 2006 twice. Basically locked up. One time it would pop fuses. Going off memory, thought there was a single 25A inline fuse for the power lines that ran to the generator to start it. I have the breaker that switches the power from shore to generator on the elec panel. There may be something more behind the panel.

 

[Meanwhile]

Thanks for the info. I'll look behind the panel to see if that is where they stashed the box.

I was curious so I took the original pump apart. The metal that was the mounting brace would have been a perfect stainless application. They used soft steel. It was very corroded. After cutting the brace away the plastic outer shell came apart to reveal a path to clean the filter. I never realized that. The filter was very clean.

This pump was built for a long lasting service life but they used mild steel. Anyway, a few photos after I managed to open up the filter.

I'll continue to assess the FP after I get a new fuel pump installed.

After I hit the pump with a hammer I could get it to turn on. It must have been jammed. The top had the worst of the corrosion but had not broken in yet.

 

[HMBJack]

Replacing that fuel pump is of course a good idea.
FWIW, I replaced mine with a Facet PN #40185 9.0-11.5 PSI (32 GPH).

I personally do not think your issue has anything to do with the capacitors.

If your panel continues to not light up, check for an inline 100 amp fuse between your battery bank and the thick "+" cable leading to your Generator. On my 330, this 100 amp fuse (yes I know - it's a BIG one), is right behind the Battery Perko switches.

On mine, I think the starter got stuck and when I tried to start my generator, the 100 amp fuse did what it was supposed to do (i.e. blow). I replaced the fuse with a new one and it blew as well (because the starter/generator remained locked up).

My solution was to simply turn the generator a crank or two by hand to get it off that "hard spot" where it was locked.

I did this with a 10mm open end/box wrench + a long rod. The open end of the wrench goes on the 10mm nut (on the crank shaft) and you use a looong screw driver or rod on the box end of the wrench so you can get leverage to turn the crankshaft. Kinda like a two piece lug nut wrench. Being a diesel, it's hard to turn without some sort of leverage.

After I turned the crank as per above and with a 3rd 100 amp fuse, everything worked great. Hope this helps.

 

[wspitler]

On my 2007 330, the AC control box is behind a panel in the aft cabin port side near the wash down and freshwater pump. I had to replace some solid-state relays in Control box and some have four capacitors others have only two. I seem to remember there are also fuses inside that AC control box so that is a good place to check. Being a diesel, it is shut down with a fuel shut off valve near the top of the motor. It is electrical and it is failsafe closed so if it loses electrical power it shuts fuel off. The fuel pump itself runs until power is removed. Not sure what you mean by turning on the cooling water? The water pump runs on a belt off of the generator itself on my boat. There is a heat exchanger but there is no water pump that requires turning on. Of course you must open the seacock to allow the pump to use raw water to cool the antifreeze in the heat exchanger.

 

[teaklejr]

On our 2007 305 Express the control box is behind the fridge. Check the fuse that is right by the fuel pump and starter relay. Pretty sure mine was doing the same thing and it ended up being the fuse holder itself.

 

[Meanwhile]

Thanks for the replies, they have given me a better idea what to check prior to UPS delivering the new fuel pump.

 

[Meanwhile]

First, I replaced the fuel pump. Had I looked in the Panda parts kit I had a spare. I needed an extra anyway. I had to change out the fittings to 1/4". It is the less expensive pump.



I've looked in and around the genset for some type of fuse that I've overlooked.
I've had no luck, I can trace the wires to the batteries, no fuse.

I found the AC Control box behind the port wall in the mid berth. I don't see any kind of fuse in it.



I looked behind the remote control panel, no fuse.



I'm stumped. I'll call FP tomorrow.

 

[wspitler]

Can I assume that you removed the cover to the AC control box and saw the capacitors and the relays? I believe there are fuses inside the box. On my boat they left enough wire so that I could pull the control box into the aft berth and work on it there.

 

[teaklejr]

If you go to page 14 on the manual you will see the 2 relays and a fuse right next to them, that's the fuse holder I had to replace. Also in this pic the I circled the relays and pointed to the fuse. That's as long as we have the same Panda but I bet we do.

https://fischerpanda.com/marine-pdf/Panda_PMS_4200FCB_Partlist.V05.pdf

 

[Meanwhile]

If you go to page 14 on the manual you will see the 2 relays and a fuse right next to them, that's the fuse holder I had to replace. Also in this pic the I circled the relays and pointed to the fuse. That's as long as we have the same Panda but I bet we do.

https://fischerpanda.com/marine-pdf/Panda_PMS_4200FCB_Partlist.V05.pdf

Yes, the 25A fuse blew on my first attempt to start. It was replaced. I also replaced the relays. I tested the relays and the old ones seem fine.

However, on the back of the remote control panel I did find a fuse. I guess my eyes are worse than I knew, I only saw the fuse after blowing up my photo. Now where to source this fuse?

 

[Meanwhile]

I took the starter off and bench tested it. Seems fine.

Also put the continuity test on the little round fuse and the tester gave a solid tone.

Traded emails with FP staff. Hopefully more info tomorrow.

 

[Angler Management]

I think you've covered everything. I had to replace that brown button fuse once, but it's really just a safety for the remote switch. My normal issue is those relays... one for fuel, one for starting. And the 30 amp fuse next to it.
Mine has a big problem starting after not being used for a while. It's not uncommon for me to spend a half hour or more doing several series of 6 to 10 second cranks, then letting it rest. A fully charged starting battery is a must, and keep your battery charger ON the genny doesn't charge it's own battery except through supplying power to the charger. The genny will eventually shut off if the charger is not on at the breaker panel.

 

[Meanwhile]

On my 330, this 100 amp fuse (yes I know - it's a BIG one), is right behind the Battery Perko switches.


Why didn't I read this a bit more closely. I went back to basics, started cutting wire flex ties off and tugging on the red cable. Why? Because there was no continuity between my battery and the FP red cable. Hmm.

Yup, found the 100 Amp fuse right where you said. In my defense it was hidden by all the cables and the guts of the person switch box. I took the switch box off and pulled the cable but it didn't move an iota. I stuck my head through the opening to see the fuse. After I got some of the putty out of my hair, I removed the fuse.

Photo shows a very badly corroded cable, the stainless lock ring broken from corrosion and the fitting. I'm surprised it functioned at all.

Thanks so much for all the input. I'll work to read suggestions more closely.

So on my genset I need to make a device to manually turn the shaft. There is a bar inside that I can fit something on to turn. I'll use a socket and grind out a fitting to fit the small bar. No 10mm nut on mine. I guess they were built to use a hand crank way back when.

Which way does the shaft turn. I'm guessing clockwise looking from the port side.

I'm wanting to see if the cylinder is frozen.

Glad I got the hydraulic press for the new cable I'll make.

Randy

 

[HMBJack]

You're on the right track now.

Glad you read my input again.
You need to be able to manually turn the crank shaft to get the FP off that hard spot.
I think i turned my crank clockwise. Making up a tool to do this is smart. And keep it on the boat in your tool kit.

By the looks of your 100 amp fuse, you're lucky you didn't have a fire of some sort!
Best to re-do that fuse block and make it all happy again. Having spare 100 amp fuses is not a waste of $.

Good luck and please report back on your progress.

 

[teaklejr]

Just to check again about the fuse by the relays, did you check for power on both sides of fuse when plugged in? I could wiggle the fuse holder and get power to both sides and then panel inside would light up, wiggle some more and panel would go out.

 

[Meanwhile]

From FP:

You can bar the crank in either direction actually. That is a good idea, we need to see if she even has a chance of running for us. And that 25amp controls fuse protect all of the controls components if it's blown nothing gets it's DC power. It will pop if something draws too much current or there is a short to ground in controls circuit. The panel has its own branch fuse as well 5amo


That 100amp fuse is to protect starter cycle. Our starter is a 1kw motor that under normal circumstances will draw 60-80amp during crank.

Me:
FP took the time to email me on a Saturday when he has his own projects. Very nice of him.
Thanks again for the advice.
Ordered new fuse holder and extra fuses. I'll make a new cable today.

 

[Meanwhile]

Here is my workaround to run the genset inside my shop. Same works for the AC discharge. 1 1/4" PVC with 4 jigsaw blade cuts and a healthy amount of plastic tape to hold the hose.

fitting on the filter helps with clean water.

 

[Fishtales]

Potential fuse..

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[Meanwhile]

Thanks Fishtales.