Engine starts runs fine then dies out...

[INSURANCEMAN]

Hi all hope everyone had a great 4th. I’ve had a strange issue happen a couple times. I run my boat everything is perfect the whole time. I stop get fuel, or like the other night eat dinner. Start her up...leave and after a couple of minutes in the no wake zone then give her gas and she dies. My primer bulb seems to have air. After a few squeezes she starts back and runs fine like nothing has happened at all. This hasn’t happened every time but it has happened to me 3 times now so looking for ideas.

2006 Yamaha 200 140 hours on it and here is what I’ve done so far.

Bought boat added Yamaha ring free was less than 10 gallons of gas in the boat. Added 20 gallons since she had been sitting awhile.

Changed fuel/water separator
Changed fuel filter.
Have filled up twice now with marine fuel from the yacht club no ethanol

As I said this hasn’t happened every time but last night had my wife and kids with me and we were heading back as it was getting dark and she did it. The day before I ran all day with not a problem one.

Any ideas? Thanks.

 

[leeccoll]

Is it stalling out after you ran it hard (30+ minutes cruising), then shut down fast, then next time you start engine up happens in the first 5 minutes?
Had this problem...I believe it was caused by vapor lock. Honda BF200 engine.
As soon as I let the boat idle for 5-10 mins after running 30+ mins at 3900 rpm, problem has not come up again. Happened 3 separate times to me this season.
Changed all my filters as well as a precaution.

Fuel issues are very troublesome. Good luck and keep us posted.

Lee

 

[INSURANCEMAN]

Is it stalling out after you ran it hard, then shut down fast, then next time you start engine up happens in the first 5 minutes?
Had this problem...I believe it was caused by vapor lock. Honda BF200 engine.
As soon as I let the boat idle for 5-10 mins after running 30+ mins at 3900 rpm, problem has not come up again. Happened 3 separate times to me this season.
Changed all my filters as well as a precaution.

Fuel issues are very troublesome. Good luck and keep us posted.

Lee

Well I actually ran 30 mins or so to the yacht club down the river let boat idle while tying up had dinner and a drink with the family. Got on the boat started fine. Came out after about 5 mins of a slow (no wake/idle) then she died out on me. Primer was soft pumped it up 4-5 times she started right up continued running perfectly all the way home. I checked my vent the best I could. I’m going to take a piece of weed wackier line and run down it if I can. I think I may replace my primer bulb too. Not sure what else it could be? If it happens again I’m pulling her and having it looked at.

 

[SkunkBoat]

to test if its the vent ... loosening the gas cap will make the problem go away.

 

[leeccoll]

Well I actually ran 30 mins or so to the yacht club down the river let boat idle while tying up had dinner and a drink with the family. Got on the boat started fine. Came out after about 5 mins of a slow (no wake/idle) then she died out on me. Primer was soft pumped it up 4-5 times she started right up continued running perfectly all the way home. I checked my vent the best I could. I’m going to take a piece of weed wackier line and run down it if I can. I think I may replace my primer bulb too. Not sure what else it could be? If it happens again I’m pulling her and having it looked at.

So that's pretty similar. Suggest next time to clock your idle minutes. Sometimes a few minutes feels like ten. When I flush the engines 8 minutes seems like alot longer if you catch my drift. And when you come down off of plane a gradual descent to idle over a few minutes might help.
Just trying to see if the easy fix works first

 

[Doc Stressor]

I've come across a similar problem many times over the years.

The first thing to do is to run the engine off a portable tank using a different fuel hose. If the problem goes away, the issue is your fuel flow.

The possibilities are:

1. Your tank vent is blocked. Test as suggested above by loosening your filler cap.
2. Your primer bulb has a bad flow check valve. Remove or replace your primer bulb. Since you have an electric fuel pump you don't really need the primer bulb except to quickly fill your fuel filters.
3. A bad anti-siphon valve at the tank end of your fuel line. This is a common cause of intermittent fuel flow. Some people just run without the anti-siphon valve, but it's best to replace it with a new one.
4. The intake screen in the fuel pickup tube in the tank is clogged or obstructed. My friend's boat was once sabotaged when somebody put a plastic bag down his fuel filler. The engine would run for a while and then stall. By the time we figured out the problem (by pulling the pickup tube) the engine was destroyed from running lean every time the obstruction caused it to stall.

Most of the time a new primer bulb or anti-siphon valve will fix the problem.

 

[INSURANCEMAN]

So that's pretty similar. Suggest next time to clock your idle minutes. Sometimes a few minutes feels like ten. When I flush the engines 8 minutes seems like alot longer if you catch my drift. And when you come down off of plane a gradual descent to idle over a few minutes might help.
Just trying to see if the easy fix works first

Perfect thank you going to give it a shot.

 

[teaklejr]

I had a problem once where when I replaced the spin on fuel filter there was a small bit of corrosion where the o-ring seals the filter to the housing and it was allowing it to suck air in and not fill up the filter. Just figured I would mention that.

 

[INSURANCEMAN]

I had a problem once where when I replaced the spin on fuel filter there was a small bit of corrosion where the o-ring seals the filter to the housing and it was allowing it to suck air in and not fill up the filter. Just figured I would mention that.

You know I replaced my water fuel separator and that was one of the first things I checked. I am pretty sure I have it on tight but I have another one. So I might just pull it off and put another one on just to make sure. Thanks.

 

[Doc Stressor]

There are a number of engine side problems that can cause your issue. That's why you want to do the test with an external fuel tank first. Otherwise, you might just be throwing expensive parts at the problem.

 

[seasick]

Check the flange on the underside of the filter mount, not the filter itself. Sometimes a piece of an older filter gets stuck and the new filter won't seal correctly.
Likewise if you changes the filter element on the motor fuel filter, make sure the bowl is seated correctly. It is easy to get it a bit off and it will leak air.

All that said, I am not so sure those are causes of your problem. I would suspect an air leak in the fuel line between the tank and the primer or you may have weak lp pumps . It seems that during the off time after running and ten shutting down, the fuel system is loosing prime.
So when you start up, you pull the fuel that is in the lines and filter but that is not being replaced due to an air leak or a bad/ weak pump. so in effect you run out of fuel. By pumping the primer you suck up new gas. The primer may actually have more suction than your low pressure pump(s). Once the lines has gas in them, they are able to maintain enough suction to keep the gas flowing

 

[INSURANCEMAN]

Well it happened again...sort of! I came out of the same exact no wake zone after fueling up and started to give it to her and I felt her start to die out. I went back to N and then to the back of the boat and squeezed the primer bulb two times and she was completely fine the entire day. I know if I pull her out and take it somewhere it will never ever duplicate what it is doing since it is so infrequent. I stopped by and talked to a Yamaha Mechanic that I know well enough...a good one. He happened to be in a good mood and was willing to listen to my issue. I told him what the motor was doing. He looked up and smiled and said you know the only reason I know this is because I had a good friend that had the same motor doing the exact same thing. He said one of two things...you have a air getting in the line or you have an anti siphon valve that is sticking...which is causing the low pressure pump to run out of fuel. He told me just yank out the anti siphon valve or knock out the spring and brass ball. Anyway...I took all of the hoses and cut the ends and reattached each one with hose clamps from the anti siphon valve back to the ones coming off of the water fuel water separator to the ones going to the engine from the primer bulb. It's connected good. The hoses look in great shape. I am sure it is not a hose...The water fuel separator I pulled cleaned the top of the mounting fixture made sure no old seal there. Made sure it was tight no leaks. Pulled the hose to the anti siphon valve and sprayed carb cleaner heavily all in there and figure that will clean up and gum that might be causing the spring and ball to stick. I don't want to take the ball out and I will probably just buy a new one to put in soon anyway.

Well I am keeping my fingers crossed but I feel more than confident that this was the issue the way he described it made perfect sense!

 

[SkunkBoat]

Another one to think about-
One time I had removed the fuel line from hose barb, trimmed it and reconnected...as part of other spring maintenance.
Long story short, the fuel hose has a clear liner, inside a black tubing, covered by grey. The clear lining had pushed in a little and acted like a check valve in the wrong direction.

 

[INSURANCEMAN]

Another one to think about-
One time I had removed the fuel line from hose barb, trimmed it and reconnected...as part of other spring maintenance.
Long story short, the fuel hose has a clear liner, inside a black tubing, covered by grey. The clear lining had pushed in a little and acted like a check valve in the wrong direction.

Wow that’s something I didn’t think of. I did cut the hoses with pipe cutters so I’d have a really clean cut. I didn’t notice anything that would have been in the line. I really hope I’ve gotten it. I sprayed more than enough carb cleaner in there and have a can of sea foam in the fuel so hopefully the anti-syphon valve spring and ball is good now. I only use non ethanol fuel but not sure what the other owner used.

 

[everwhom]

Really sounds like you're losing prime because pumping the primer ball fixes the problem at least temporarily and the ball isn't getting sucked flat. So that suggests you have a small air leak somewhere along the fuel lines between the motor and the fuel tank pickup. I'm guessing you have to pump your primer ball at the beginning of every trip too? These can be hard to track down, but basically check every connection and, as others have mentioned, the sealing around your fuel filters. I think they recommend smearing some motor motor oil on the rubber ring which may help make it seal. Don't crank the filter on too tight though or it will be very difficult to remove.

I had a similar problem that almost ruined father's day a few years back... In the end I'm pretty sure it was a badly seated filter though it really showed no signs. As my fuel lines were quite old anyways, I ended up replacing all the lines -- they are only meant to last about 10 years as I recall.

 

[INSURANCEMAN]

Really sounds like you're losing prime because pumping the primer ball fixes the problem at least temporarily and the ball isn't getting sucked flat. So that suggests you have a small air leak somewhere along the fuel lines between the motor and the fuel tank pickup. I'm guessing you have to pump your primer ball at the beginning of every trip too? These can be hard to track down, but basically check every connection and, as others have mentioned, the sealing around your fuel filters. I think they recommend smearing some motor motor oil on the rubber ring which may help make it seal. Don't crank the filter on too tight though or it will be very difficult to remove.

I had a similar problem that almost ruined father's day a few years back... In the end I'm pretty sure it was a badly seated filter though it really showed no signs. As my fuel lines were quite old anyways, I ended up replacing all the lines -- they are only meant to last about 10 years as I recall.

Hi Thanks a lot. Actually the primer ball doesn't need to be pumped at all - except when this happens. I did put a bit of oil on the water fuel separator when I installed that. Thanks for the tip about getting it off! haha...man my former boat a Parker - the former owner must have ate his spinach when he put it on. I didn't think I would ever get it off. I had to get the jaws of life to get that thing off. Anyway...Thanks I really appreciate the help. The weather hasn't cooperated for me to take her out and see how it goes yet but I am a betting man and betting that the anti siphon valve was gummed up!