Grady white 228g soft spot

seasick

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
9,531
Reaction score
1,420
Points
113
Location
NYC
I did same as Leeccoll, one layer of cloth under wood, two over. Put a 45 on all edges to be filled with epoxy/cabosil mixture so all screws would not be going thru wood
View attachment 17841View attachment 17842

Rock solid
I am not sure that Leeccoll applied cloth under the wood.
For the pieced approached, cloth would be wetted and applied to a wetted underside of the lid. Then the wood pieces would be wetted and applied onto the wet cloth. After a bit of setup time ( resin tacky but not wet, the top would be wetted and glassed.
If the wood is just pressed onto the wetted underside of the lid, in addition to possible voids, the bare wood (especially when cut into small pieces can wick up the resin resulting in spotty poor adhesion. Maybe I am making it more complicated than necessary.
I would also like to know what resin folks used;epoxy or polyester.
 

leeccoll

GreatGrady Captain
Joined
May 18, 2019
Messages
1,052
Reaction score
416
Points
83
Age
60
Location
Reno NV
Model
Seafarer
On my repair I used same approach as Willi-C. I used West Systems 105 epoxy and 206 hardener. Fiberglass mat was Evercoat.

One layer under the plywood, 2 layers on top.

Can still remember those fumes during the curing process on a hot summer day. :(
 

DennisG01

GreatGrady Captain
Joined
Sep 1, 2013
Messages
7,191
Reaction score
1,341
Points
113
Location
Allentown, PA & Friendship, ME
Model
Offshore
Polyester resin it totally fine to use and is much less expensive than epoxy. Epoxy is stronger, but that's not really something that comes into play here - polyester is more than strong enough - most boats are made with polyester. However, the big advantage of epoxy is that it's easier to work with and MUCH less smelly than polyester.

Pretty much any epoxy brand out there will be fine. Nothing wrong with West - I've used it plenty of times and still do - it's just more expensive. For the last big job I did, I ordered from US Composites.

The big advantage of the small squares is avoiding air pockets underneath. One thing to keep in mind is that when the boat was built, the floor was upside down and the topside gelcoat was actually the first part of the process. The squares were second last - with the underneath "onion skin" layer of glass being the last. In the case of a hatches, the same process happens, but the bottom layer is heavier glass, like 1708. When rebuilding a hatch, one layer of 1708 is plenty - it doesn't hurt anything to do a second layer of the stuff, it's just not really needed.

Here's a hatch that I built from scratch - about 2'x2' - and experimented with using just one piece of plywood. Even though I weighted it down, it still had air bubbles that were noticeable through the top layers of glass. To fix it, I simply took a grinder to the air bubbles and then came back and filled the voids before topcoating. Drilling a number of 1" holes in the wood probably would have done the trick - but I think I may have ended up with minor depressions where the holes were in the topside that still would need to be filled - or at least there's the chance of that. Using smaller squares would have been easier to avoid the air pockets. I took extra steps to first ensure that the "table" was perfectly flat.

IMG-4233.jpg


On a larger hatch, that I mentioned above, using the foamboard eliminated the possibility of air pockets since it was flexible and I could slightly bend it as I was laying it in.

IMG-4070.jpg
 

Jacktrop99

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 9, 2020
Messages
57
Reaction score
4
Points
8
Age
24
Model
Seafarer
So does this mean my boat has rot I got it from a fresh water environment and was like new but it was never surveyed and it rides great but since it is a 30 year old boat rot really scares me
 

Jacktrop99

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 9, 2020
Messages
57
Reaction score
4
Points
8
Age
24
Model
Seafarer
So does this mean my boat has rot I got it from a fresh water environment and was like new but it was never surveyed and it rides great but since it is a 30 year old boat rot really scares me
I also don’t have very much money and was wondering about the whole boat in general because I have noticed that it likes to sink down in the back on a full tank but I have put that to the heavy motor and I don’t know much about what a core is I’m hoping it’s just the hatch is rotten the bilge always has water in it but idk I’m just praying the boat isn’t rotten to the point that it would cost a lot to repair, is this something that should be done or it’s just to prevent the soft spot, I’m just praying my hot isn’t rotten before this one I had a 1986 192 dual console and that boat was solid this boat is just starting to concern me but it’s always been on a dry stack or on a trailer never sat in the water more then a few days. My last question does spraying your boat down with a hose on the inside create rot, most of the water goes down the scuffers but I’m thinking that could create problems but maby not if so how else do I clean it after use
 

Jacktrop99

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 9, 2020
Messages
57
Reaction score
4
Points
8
Age
24
Model
Seafarer
Just wondering....when you take the hatch off, do you easily see that the underside are all those squares? I opened up mine and didn’t see any of that, just glassed up....
Yeah mine is just all glasses when I pull the hatch up it’s all just like white it’s all glassed
 

DennisG01

GreatGrady Captain
Joined
Sep 1, 2013
Messages
7,191
Reaction score
1,341
Points
113
Location
Allentown, PA & Friendship, ME
Model
Offshore
Rot happens from water entry into the various cores used throughout the boat. The only reason water would enter the core is if it's compromised from damage/cracking/improper screwing/lack of maintenance/etc. In other words, it doesn't "magically" happen.
 

Jacktrop99

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 9, 2020
Messages
57
Reaction score
4
Points
8
Age
24
Model
Seafarer
Rot happens from water entry into the various cores used throughout the boat. The only reason water would enter the core is if it's compromised from damage/cracking/improper screwing/lack of maintenance/etc. In other words, it doesn't "magically" happen.
Yeah the has had a soft spot since I bought it 2 years ago I have some things that have happened like hard pounding in are inlet or ocean and I’ve hit some small brush in are river but I wouldn’t think that that would cause damage but I’m not an expert
 

Jacktrop99

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 9, 2020
Messages
57
Reaction score
4
Points
8
Age
24
Model
Seafarer
Also
Yeah the has had a soft spot since I bought it 2 years ago I have some things that have happened like hard pounding in are inlet or ocean and I’ve hit some small brush in are river but I wouldn’t think that that would cause damage but I’m not an expert
are boat has been very well maintained just waxed every year and engine maintenance covering it after use and cleaning it up but I just feel like that if there is rot I have no clue how it got in because the boat has been kept very well over the year super well maintained and all never abused but when I bought it I was using it pretty hard but I wouldn’t think that would damage the boat but if the only reason it is soft is due to rot I just want to know if that could be linked to rot In other places but otherwise the boat feels solid and sits correctly in the water there is some super small like 1 inch spider cracks in the gelcoat on the bottom of the boat like 4 of them and there is a chip in the back corner from dock bashing but it’s like a foot above the water line and that was after we bought it, if it needs to be done I will do it if it’s not a big deal and it’s just a think to bring up the value and won’t do any damage in the future I won’t do it
 
Last edited:

DennisG01

GreatGrady Captain
Joined
Sep 1, 2013
Messages
7,191
Reaction score
1,341
Points
113
Location
Allentown, PA & Friendship, ME
Model
Offshore
Yeah the has had a soft spot since I bought it 2 years ago I have some things that have happened like hard pounding in are inlet or ocean and I’ve hit some small brush in are river but I wouldn’t think that that would cause damage but I’m not an expert
Where is the soft spot? You kind left out that key piece of info... :)
 

wrxhoon

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 4, 2012
Messages
958
Reaction score
291
Points
63
Location
Sydney Australia
On older boats it is held down with screws my 2013 228G doesn't have any fixing screws. Water eventually gets in the core from the screw holes , some people do them up very tight and could crack the top layer then water will get in from there.
If the transom and stringers are dry, just repair the floor. It's very easy to do , if you don't wat to do it yourself take it to a F/G specialist it shouldn't be expensive.
 

Jacktrop99

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 9, 2020
Messages
57
Reaction score
4
Points
8
Age
24
Model
Seafarer
On older boats it is held down with screws my 2013 228G doesn't have any fixing screws. Water eventually gets in the core from the screw holes , some people do them up very tight and could crack the top layer then water will get in from there.
If the transom and stringers are dry, just repair the floor. It's very easy to do , if you don't wat to do it yourself take it to a F/G specialist it shouldn't be expensive.
I know I’m kinda dragging this thread but how can I tell if my trans one is ok it feels very solid not weak at all I’m thinking the rest of the hot is solid I’ve been in some roughy conditions beating on jt
 

HTHM

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2019
Messages
148
Reaction score
41
Points
28
Age
62
Location
Mount Hope, On, Canada
I know I’m kinda dragging this thread but how can I tell if my trans one is ok it feels very solid not weak at all I’m thinking the rest of the hot is solid I’ve been in some roughy conditions beating on jt
Do a tap test, also known as sounding, take a smooth face hammer and lightly tap the outside surface of the transom in a 4" rectangular pattern across the entire transom. You will hear a pinging sound if the transom is solidly adhered to the outside skin and a dull thump if not.
 

Fishtales

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 31, 2005
Messages
8,034
Reaction score
1,286
Points
113
I don't think it magically happened either. It happens by poor design and workmanship during the build as well as add ons and maintenance post sale. Between mounting screws through deck wood, soft decks, transom replacements, hull coring intrusion, use of fairing compound in key areas (really - used on the transom and decklids and hardtop - ever wonder why they chip like crazy), non tinned wire, wiring routing and staking a third grader could do better... I'm starting to wonder if they know what they are doing when they design and build these boats. The materials seem first rate. It's what they do with them that is the issue. I know it is a little butt hurt for the fan boys, but the build techniques are questionable at best and not what I expect of a so called top-tier production boat.
 

Fishtales

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 31, 2005
Messages
8,034
Reaction score
1,286
Points
113
One single piece is far more likely to warp over time. Small pieces will not. Also, you would be limiting yourself to 1/2" ply in that case. I liked using the 3/4" in the center section for more rigidity (is that really a word LOL).

agree but a big tradeoff is you have a crap load of end pieces to wick up moisture. i guess if glassed right, you should be able to seal them all. plywood should be pretty stable especially when glassed.
 

Willy-C

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 5, 2012
Messages
189
Reaction score
66
Points
28
Age
68
Location
Hooksett, NH
like above I also did the weight thing, while the first layer of fabric (not sure type but for epoxy) was wet we buttered the wood, placed with weights and let cure on flat concrete, next day 2 more layers.DB0247E2-A4B9-4773-A164-404D24F6B6E4.jpeg
 

seasick

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
9,531
Reaction score
1,420
Points
113
Location
NYC
End grain can be an issue but since the marine plywood is made with moisture resistant glues, it isn't all that absorbent. However, it is important to get the new resin into those cracks or better yet, butter all sides of each piece and squish into place. For smaller panels. vacuum bagging will just about eliminate and voids or not wetted edges.
like above I also did the weight thing, while the first layer of fabric (not sure type but for epoxy) was wet we buttered the wood, placed with weights and let cure on flat concrete, next day 2 more layers.View attachment 17902
I guess you used epoxy and not polyester resin because if you let the fist layer cure for a day or more and then applied more layers with polyester resin, you have to rough sand the dry layer since polyester resin doesn't stick to cured polyester like epoxy will.
 

wrxhoon

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 4, 2012
Messages
958
Reaction score
291
Points
63
Location
Sydney Australia
I know I’m kinda dragging this thread but how can I tell if my trans one is ok it feels very solid not weak at all I’m thinking the rest of the hot is solid I’ve been in some roughy conditions beating on jt

One way to test the transom strength, tilt the motor up have someone bouncing it and watch the transom for flex. If there isn't any flex it should be fine. Another way drill a couple holes ( 1/8")on the inside of the transom somewhere close to the main bolts . Check the wood shavings for moisture or dry rot. Don't forget to seal the holes.