New Pipe for Hardtop

[ROBERTH]

Anyone every had a new pipe build for their hardtop? Not sure if I would call it a tower, but the existing factory aluminum pipe keeps getting cracked and I have had several weld jobs done and re-inforcements/gussets installed as well as additional stress pipes installed over last few years.
I continue to get occassional cracks due to some rough offshore runs here in NC.
I have re-inforced the mounting areas and checked for any bad wood. Actually had to redo backside of one of the mounts on the starboard rear corner due to leaking around the bolts. Even the folks that did the welding was very aware of what caused cracks and where it would come from based on where the crack occurred and they have checked as well and found no weakness in the mounting areas.
I am thinking that the aluminum corrosion from within the pipes has weakened enough over the last 28 years warrants need for new pipe/tower build.

Question is has anyone done this and if so, any ballpark the price to do this ?

 

[Fishtales]

if you are in NC, why not call the manufacturer and ask them? Maybe they can replace it at a decent cost and dissect the situation. I know if I made them, I'd want to understand the use case.
Website... Winterville Machine Works.

Grady White T Tops | Hard Tops | Rod Holders | Grady White Boats Authorized Facility. WMW Marine. Winterville North Carolina (NC)

 

[Ky Grady]

I agree with fishtales on this. I'd reach out to them if it was my boat and talk with them. If you have to go the new route, I'd have them do the work as well. Nothing like the OEM fit versus trial and error fit, unless you go full custom and drop boat off to a fabrication shop to design a new one.

I've only had two cracks show up on mine and they were there when I bought the boat. One was fixed by PO, the other I had fixed this year.

 

[GWPW]

Anyone every had a new pipe build for their hardtop? Not sure if I would call it a tower, but the existing factory aluminum pipe keeps getting cracked and I have had several weld jobs done and re-inforcements/gussets installed as well as additional stress pipes installed over last few years.
I continue to get occassional cracks due to some rough offshore runs here in NC.
I have re-inforced the mounting areas and checked for any bad wood. Actually had to redo backside of one of the mounts on the starboard rear corner due to leaking around the bolts. Even the folks that did the welding was very aware of what caused cracks and where it would come from based on where the crack occurred and they have checked as well and found no weakness in the mounting areas.
I am thinking that the aluminum corrosion from within the pipes has weakened enough over the last 28 years warrants need for new pipe/tower build.

Question is has anyone done this and if so, any ballpark the price to do this ?

You will probably want to get a complete new frame and top made. The older frames were known to have issues for many reasons. Why I would say to get a new fiberglass top is that they use to use a balsa wood core for the tops. We have seen many of them water logged which adds a lot of weight to the top. This could be one of the major factors in why your are having issues.

 

[ROBERTH]

Thanks for the feedback folks. I just sent an online quote request to WMW and see if they still make or offer these frames.
Regarding the hardtop, I have tested and checked all areas of the core when re-drilling or re-sealing where anything is mounted and so far, always get dry clean wood out. Never any black or moist wood, so think I am on the hardtop.
However, it is interesting point on the hardtop weight. The cracks are always on the back outer legs. I had made up a PVC block to drop the height of the rocket launcher rod holders down and also was able to mount some 6" speakers in this same block of PVC.
I am not thinking that the weight of this block of PVC might be adding the excessive weight allowing the hardtop to sway further during shock hits from waves.
I recall that this block of PVC is fairly heavy. Might be enough to cause the issue.
So now, I think I will take this block off, core it out as much as I can, only leaving the areas where the rocket launcher mounts and see how much weight reduction I can get. Then maybe that is mostly my issue.

 

[ROBERTH]

Update, I just removed the PVC block and weight it with the speakers is 20lbs .Way heavier than I thought. This might have been my problem all along.
I am using some of this block to make speaker boxes and will mount them under the helm and re-install the original rocket launcher for now. Here is a pic of the PVC block with speakers so it might make more sense what I am talking about.

 

[glacierbaze]

20 pounds should not crack the support legs. You would have more than that with 5 large trolling outfits in the rocket launcher.

 

[ROBERTH]

I hear you Glacier....but am not so sure on that. Agree some heavy trolling gear would add up. However, rods will possibly have a different affect than the solid block...dunno....maybe.......Just seems that this weight being at the very top aft is not a good thing. If you held this block and simulated left/right sway, you can really fell the pull on your body trying to hold it. The cracks are always on the inside aft and high. I think the sway impacts are causing the issue. Watch someone's Bimini rock back and forth in a wave. Lots of sideways movement so any excess weight can't help it for sure.
Anyhow, time will tell as I have removed this issue and will get the welding done this spring. I would love to replace with a new frame. Just have to see if WMW can make one and at a reasonable price. Then the effort to replace it is not a small job.

On another note: New issue..... I am not able to remount my 6" speakers anywhere in the helm area due to compass distance.

Thinking of mounting in the gunnel just to the side where you step up and start to go around to the front in the walkaround channel. There is a nice flat panel there that could accept a 6" hole. I am hesitant though to cut another hole!

There is plenty of room behind and holding the speaker in this location is better than 6' away from the compass and I did not see it cause any affects to the compass.

Only concern I have it what it will sound like with the open space behind the panel as it will allow sound out into the cockpit area. Assume that is no big deal though? Any thoughts on that?

 

[GWPW]

I see now also you have a 1992 Grady. Some of the old tops had a lot of issues with breaking. Seeing the picture with the speakers up I see someone at one time tried to add some pipework in to help fix the problem.

 

[ROBERTH]

Actually, I have had several re-enforcements done to help. They have installed pipes running from front to back on sides, added gussets and one large pipe running from side to side, curved to help with the stress. All this helped, and has gone a couple years with no cracks, but the last trip we took was a rough one and took a lot of side hits/shocks which started a new small crack on the one side.

Here, with this pic, you can see all the efforts put in to stop the cracking:

 

[Fishtales]

Probably just time and stress taking it's toll. WMW should be able to tighen you up.

 

[GWPW]

Actually, I have had several re-enforcements done to help. They have installed pipes running from front to back on sides, added gussets and one large pipe running from side to side, curved to help with the stress. All this helped, and has gone a couple years with no cracks, but the last trip we took was a rough one and took a lot of side hits/shocks which started a new small crack on the one side.

Here, with this pic, you can see all the efforts put in to stop the cracking:
View attachment 18067

WOW that's a lot of repairs. I wonder if there is something happening with the boat itself. I know we have done some repairs over the years for local Grady dealer and Grady had sent them pieces to install in places underdeck to support where the top was mounted. Not talking about backing plates or anything like that but more to eliminate twist in the boat.

I would say its time for new pipe work, just don't copy the original design...LOL

 

[ROBERTH]

Agree GW, for sure I think would go with a heavier duty pipe, not sure what gauge this is vs what's out there and maybe even larger for the main legs.
In regards to the boat, seems very sound. No wood rot anywhere to be found, I have large backing plates I made in each mounting area and also had fixed the 90 degree angles that bolt the walkaround to the deck in the aft section.

I really think the age of the pipe is a strong factor, and also maybe the design could have been improved with correct placement of gussets, etc.

If I can get any feedback from WMW, I will see what they can do to add extra strength during the manuf. process. But, if this next weld holds me, I might be ok for a while. Just need to weigh out my options here.

One thing I can say is I love the pipe they added running fore/aft. It is a great hand hold in the seas when trying to get forward and back.

 

[Finest Kind]

You gotta use those trim tabs and get the nose down....plus back off on the throttle and ease into those swells...try to minimize slamming and your pipes will love you for it.

Plus good point about the heavy trolling rods noted above......run with the heavy rods in the gunnel holders, use the hardtop holders for the light spinners.

 

[ROBERTH]

Hi Finest, trust me, the tabs are down and in some cases all the way down. In addition, I have added a lot of lead ballast to the front anchor locker to get her down more since the Grady runs aft heavy for those model years with brackets.
I can only take so much abuse at my age so I run as softly as possible.
The issue up here in NC is the long run out to about 60 miles, with confused seas and never hardly a nice swell like I was used to when I lived in Florida. I miss those seas for sure! I have found it quite different up here due to so many different currents and winds/fronts constantly blowing and confusing the seas.

I have completed the move of the weight and re-installed the original rocket launcher now, and just drilled the new holes for the speakers on the side forward gunnels. Man, I can't believe how thick this area was! It gave my Rotozip a hard workout!

 

[Finest Kind]

Gotcha Robert, I don't want to slam my boat because MY BACK CAN'T TAKE IT, not worried about the boat at all.

One question tho...are you trailering long distances in it? Could be a reason why the cracks re-appear.

I noticed cracks in my hardtop (plus loose screws all over the boat) after having my boat trailered over 1200 miles 5 times between NJ and FlaDa before I got my lift and kept it here year round.
All those miles at 60 mph on a trailer with hard suspension was really hard on the boat!

 

[ROBERTH]

I tow my boat no more than 150 miles to the coast in spring and bring it back in the fall. About 2 miles to the ramp and back home during the season. It rides on a new Road King trailer which has a very good torsion suspension. I dont ever see any stress from towing and don't feel any harshness from the truck when towing. The cracks happen after running offshore mid season after a rough trip usually. It definitely happens at sea.
I could see this being an issue for sure on a very long trip or on rough roads, but the roads here are pretty decent except when I go over one of the RR tracks near the coast. It is rough enough that I nearly stop before going over as if you go over at full speed, it will take my teeth out!