OX66 225 tilt

[Pighunter]

Yesterday I took my 228 out in San Francisco bay to fish for Halibut. Every time I tilted my motor up to adjust my bow it would slowly go back down. It only did it while driving foreword it never went down while sitting, suggesting to me that it had a leak and the power from the prop was pushing it down. There was never a oil sheen or any visible sign of a leak even back at the dock. It worked fine earlier in the week at a lake. So today I've checked fluid level and it's fine, raised motor up and down several times and tried using my weight to make it lose pressure and drop down but no luck. It won't go down on it's own, I expected to see a leak but it's not leaking.

 

[seasick]

Does it gurgle when you raise the motor? Have you checked the manual pressure release valve on the side to see if it is not tightened all the way?
Low fluid level and air could explain the tilt issues but I suspect a problem in the check valves. Before getting into that area, try flushing the system, a messy job and then replacing the fluid and bleeding per the manual instructions.
When working on the tilt system, watch your fingers! Use the safety stop when appropriate and be aware that the motor when close to tilted down is very heavy to hold.

 

[Pighunter]

Does it gurgle when you raise the motor? Have you checked the manual pressure release valve on the side to see if it is not tightened all the way?
Low fluid level and air could explain the tilt issues but I suspect a problem in the check valves. Before getting into that area, try flushing the system, a messy job and then replacing the fluid and bleeding per the manual instructions.
When working on the tilt system, watch your fingers! Use the safety stop when appropriate and be aware that the motor when close to tilted down is very heavy to hold.

No gurgling noise that I can hear. I'll find the manual pressure valve but if it wasn't tight wouldn't be leaking? Last week I topped off the the oil level last week and it was low but when I checked it today it was full.

So the manual pressure release valve was closed tight. I worked it a few times, motor lowered like it should and raises like it should. I guess whats most confusing to me is for the tilt to lower on it's own there would have to be a leak wouldn't there??

 

[seasick]

No gurgling noise that I can hear. I'll find the manual pressure valve but if it wasn't tight wouldn't be leaking? Last week I topped off the the oil level last week and it was low but when I checked it today it was full.

So the manual pressure release valve was closed tight. I worked it a few times, motor lowered like it should and raises like it should. I guess whats most confusing to me is for the tilt to lower on it's own there would have to be a leak wouldn't there??

The manual release does not drain fluid to the outside. It just causes fluid to bypass the check valve and that allows manual lowering of the motor.

Since the tank seems to be full and you don't hear gurgling, it is more likely that the check valves are clogged, there is sediment in the oil or the valves and springs are shot.
The pump and valve rebuild is complicated and can be expensive once you buy all the parts, It can be chalange to remove the tilt assembly and separate the pump from the whole mechanism
Again, I suggest that you unscrew the relief valve all the way until it comes out and have a look at its seals. Oil will most likely spill out when you take it out.
Reinstall, fill and bleed and see how it goes.
If your motor drops under thrust, you would assume that it will do the same if you hang on it. If the boat is in the water, you can tilt it up a bit and then climb on the cavitation plate to see if the LU drops.
I suppose it is possible that there is an electrical issue that is causing the trim pump to run intermittently.
Youcan also check that by disconnecting one of the tilt motor leads under the cowling at the tilt relay. Of course the motor should be in that somewhat tilted position before you disable the tilt pump. Go for a ride and see if the motor drops. If it doesn't, you may have a bad relay, wiring, cowl switch ( can be disconnected easily) or control trim switch.

 

[Pighunter]

It does appear have a leak on the center tilt ram but I don't think that would cause the trim to not hold?

Seasick I have two different manuals but I can't find how to drain the fluid. I would like to flush d add new fluid, do you know where I would drain it from? I can't see an obvious plug.

 

[seasick]

There isn't one. Other than pulling the thing apart, the best you can do is suck out oil through the fill hole. I use a big syringe with a piece of tubing attached. Raise the motor being careful underneath and suck out what you can. Then lower the motor and more fluid will enter the tank. Try to suck that out also.
At some point, the motor wont tilt up. Try refilling little by little and cycling the tilt. Unfortunately, you wont get more than half the fluid out.
A leak in the tilt cylinder can cause the motor to drop but if that was the cause, I would expect to see a sheen on the water after raising and lowering the motor a couple of times. In addition the level in the reservoir would lower.
If you are sure the tilt pump is the issue and it isn't electrical, one option is to have the unit rebuilt. There is a company that will rebuild yours assuming it isn't too far gone.
Here is a link to a re-builder

YAMAHA

Yamaha Trim & Tilt Rebuild Service 2 Year Warranty

www.trimandtilt.com

I would work on eliminating any electrical glitch first assuming you tried the stand on the cavitation plate and see if the motor droops and it didn't

 

[DennisG01]

If rebuilding the manual release/bypass doesn't work (you have to remove the circlip to get it all the way out), you're looking at rebuilding the guts. Inside, there are many, MANY seals/o-rings/springs/check balls. Fluid can leak internally past the internal seals and imitate what happens by unscrewing the manual release. Since you were low on fluid and saw an external leak, you could have... just that external leak or even an internal and external leak. Unlike the trim rams, the tilt ram can not be rebuilt without removing the unit from the boat. Everything you read online (or at least everything I had read) and the info from Yamaha says that in order to remove the unit you have take the engine off and pull the unit forward and/or remove one of the side brackets. I'm not sure why that information is out there - I was able to remove the unit just fine by slipping it out backwards (aft).

One little note... it is very tedious work to rebuild the guts. Extremely tedious. Unless you are have done this kind of stuff before, I would highly recommend just having it rebuilt for you.

 

[seasick]

I learned that too. I rebuilt mine and it was probably the worst job I have done on my boat. A zillion parts you didn't know were in there. The main pump to chamber bolts were seized to the casting and had to be carefully drilled out. Replacing ram seals is not too bad but the rest. oy!

 

[Pighunter]

I learned that too. I rebuilt mine and it was probably the worst job I have done on my boat. A zillion parts you didn't know were in there. The main pump to chamber bolts were seized to the casting and had to be carefully drilled out. Replacing ram seals is not too bad but the rest. oy!

I haven't had a chance to test the electrical yet, I can't make the motor move down at all with my 300 lbs. Hanging on the back Things are kind of on hold, we just got a evacuation warning due to these fires. I took the dog for a ride to the coast this morning and when I got back home the fire conditions changed for the worse. Wife already left I gotta get boat moved and hook up the 5th wheel but I don't think we are in any danger.

 

[seasick]

Be safe. I hope you aren't impacted.
Remember, it is just a boat. Don't take chances

 

[DennisG01]

I learned that too. I rebuilt mine and it was probably the worst job I have done on my boat. A zillion parts you didn't know were in there. The main pump to chamber bolts were seized to the casting and had to be carefully drilled out. Replacing ram seals is not too bad but the rest. oy!

Plus, it becomes one of those "while you're in there" things and you end up rebuilding every seal and miniscule o-ring you can find...

When you get a chance - for fun, take a look at this parts diagram: https://www.boats.net/catalog/yamaha/outboard-by-year/2000/sx225tury/power-trim-tilt-assembly

Stay safe.

 

[Pighunter]

Be safe. I hope you aren't impacted.
Remember, it is just a boat. Don't take chances

Everything except us is replaceable including the boat. When I say had to move the boat it was in front of our 5th wheel. We're still home, we had a out of town cop come through to help the locals and he came through yesterday with his PA telling everyone to evacuate now turned out he was in the wrong town. Last year we were evacuated for 6 days. Keep in mind we don't live in a forest we live in subdivision that was built in the 70's we have about 80 acres of pasture and oaks that backs up behind our back fence. Covid is going to make this year even harder, If we end up being evacuated I think we will park on a road somewhere in our RV, no evacuation center for us.

 

[Pighunter]

Well I ran out of Bodega Bay Ca. today for a salmon try and the tilt worked fine?? It functioned the way it should and it never went down when I powered up although I think the tilt shaft is leaking a little more. I'll probably tear it off this winter and send to the Company seasick posted.

 

[Sparkdog118]

That particular unit can be removed without removing the engine off the boat. In fact, if you are slick, the center ram can be removed without removing the trim unit. First, Take the pressure off the ram cap by loosening the manual relief screw. Be sure the engine is on the tilt stand. Then loosen the ram cap about 1 revolution using a special tool or a punch. If you use a punch, be sure to angle it away from the seal gland so the seal cavity does not get egg shaped. (Down and out direction). Then pull the trim pin out of the top of the ram. Next, unscrew the trim cap completely. The next step takes two people. Carefully lift the motor up by the lower unit slowly while someone works the piston ram out of the top of the cylinder. Be careful the weight of the power head doesn’t seasaw the lower unit into the air. (Sounds more complicated than it really is. I can usually get the ram out in 15 min). Only lift lower unit high enough to get the ram out then set it back on the stand. Now you can put the bottom ram but in a vise and use a long bar to twist the nut loose. Squeeze the washer when taking ram apart so the 4 check balls and springs don’t fall out and get lost. Now you can slide the cap off and replace the seals. May want to also replace the o ring under the ram washer.

 

[seasick]

I am still not 10% convinced the tilt assembly as opposed to a bad electrical signal. I suppose the more likely cause is the unit and it is possible that a check valve had a bit of gunk that cause it to leak. By draining/adding fluid and bleeding, you may have cleared the debris. For now as you said, I would just keep an eye on it. It might get worse or go away
Note that if you have a leak like a seal, the level in the reservoir will go down over time and you will probably see a sheen on the water (eventually). If on the other hand an internal check valve is leaky, the level won't change