Restoring the Floor Panel

[TonyD]

Hello! At some point my Grady had the Gas tank replaced and the floor was replaced where they dropped the new tank. But I guess years after that floor panel has become soft and it gives when you walk on it.
I also noticed that at the top edge, a screw has given way and the edge is giving way when you step on it.

I have a 1989 Tournament 192.. Here are some picture of what I am talking about. But my question is, how or what is the best way to remedy this? Do I replace the whole thing with Starboard or is there some kind of support I can add underneath?

 

[DennisG01]

There's a number of threads on this, try a search for them as they'll give you lot's of information. No, you won't replace it with starboard, at least not without lot's of reinforcing. The correct way to fix is:

-- Remove panel from boat
-- Cut the core out by removing the underskin of glass, and then the wooden core
-- Replace core with new marine plywood or foam
-- Lay on a piece of 1708 bi-axial glass
-- Reinstall panel, attending to any stripped screw holes, and caulk

I don't see anything in the pictures about "a screw has given way", so I'm not quite sure what you mean. But if you're basically saying the fiberglass is weak, then that area can be repaired, as well.

This is a DIY project, but can be daunting for someone who has never done glass repair. There's also a good amount of material that must be purchased and probably some tools, depending on what you already have. Given that the panel is removable, this is also an easy one to take to someone local who can do it for you. For an experienced glass person, this is cake.

 

[TonyD]

Thank you, Dennis - I'll also try a search on the topic in the forum -

about the screw giving way.. the 2nd photo.. the very top screw has softened threw the glass..but it seems that can all be fixed with your suggestions you replied with.

 

[Parthery]

I had an '86 190 Tournament...the same thing happened except it was to the in floor storage compartment/cooler.

We removed the hatch, cut and epoxied a piece of marine plywood to the back of it, and glassed over it. Worked perfectly except the cover became heavy. I had to add a gas strut to help pull it up.

Again - not a difficult job, but if you aren't comfortable working with fiberglass............

 

[DennisG01]

about the screw giving way.. the 2nd photo.. the very top screw has softened threw the glass..but it seems that can all be fixed with your suggestions you replied with.

OK, I see what you're talking about it. That area is all fiberbglass - there's no wood there. So likely there was/is a void there (air pocket). It can all be fixed.

 

[jbrinch88]

I say try to fix it yourself. Starboard would need to be reinforced from underneath with that size of a piece. This is a great project to learn how to do glasswork because it won't require you to have a nice finish as it will be underneath the floor and you won't have to look at it. I say go for it. I recently did both of mine on my 24' offshore I'm restoring. I have a thread started in the photo section with some pictures when I did mine last summer.

 

[TonyD]

Thanks, Dennis! I was getting worried about that spot.
Jbrinch - yeah I am going back and forth on it - I searched through the forum under Dennis's suggestion and it seems like an undertaking if you really don't know about working with glass but I am considering it just so I can get that experience with it.

I'll keep you all posted and I am sure if I do this, I am going to have questions and thoughts..

Thanks everyone!

 

[Curmudgeon]

Do I replace the whole thing with Starboard or is there some kind of support I can add underneath?

Starboard is lousy for weight bearing hatches. There should be a wood panel (or scrap pieces of plywood) glassed to the back side of what you have, pull it and see what's there ...

 

[TonyD]

Do I replace the whole thing with Starboard or is there some kind of support I can add underneath?

Starboard is lousy for weight bearing hatches. There should be a wood panel (or scrap pieces of plywood) glassed to the back side of what you have, pull it and see what's there ...

It's not a hatch so I can't pull it up - not until I am ready to do the work (unless I opt to have someone do it)

 

[Curmudgeon]

:sorry Uhhh, OK, take out the screws, break the sealant where it isn't already, pull up the 'panel', see what's there. In the alternative, pull the round access covers and feel around, there should be something glassed to the under side, or lateral bracing across the tank, or both. Hopefully, whoever replaced the tank didn't cut the entire lip off to get the old tank out. If so, some precise support work will be required ...

 

[TonyD]

Thanks! I pulled it off, there are lips there just not at the forward and aft of the panel - I was wondering now though - what is the best way to "gut" the panel now that I have it out?

 

[TonyD]

Never mind - I answered my question.. Pulled out the glass - the wood underneath are little squares (soak and wet!) but I thought they were glued to the panel for some reason and thought that there was a way to get out.. However, they are so saturated....

 

[TonyD]

So the squares are indeed glued to the core...also the glass around the access covers are hard to get off too.. anyone with ideas to pull this all up without damaging the core?

Thanks!!!

 

[DennisG01]

The squares ARE the core. Scrape, grind, cut them out. Replace and re-glass. Did you find any of the previous posts about this? I can look later - but don't have time, right now. I'm not the only one that posted threads/how-to's about this, but you can use my name as a qualifier in the search and look for my thread about re-doing the entire cockpit floor, hatch and even building a new hatch from scratch.

 

[TonyD]

Yeah, that would make sense.. core - the middle..

I started scraping but I was being a bit on the gentle side, afraid of damaging the panel itself... I did come across a few threads but let me do another search for more detailed how - to's.

Thank you!! I very much appreciate your help on this!!

 

[DennisG01]

You can be pretty rough with it. You're going to want to roughen up the surface before you re-glass, anyways, to get good adhesion with the epoxy. This is my thread from rebuilding the floor and hatches -- viewtopic.php?f=3&t=21139&hilit=floor -- Take a look at some of the tools I used. The shingle removal tool makes quick work of removing the majority of the wood. The Dremel oscillating tool with a scraper blade and saw blade worked very well to get the rest. The saw blade also works well to cut off any remaining fiberglass underskin. That Dremel was a real beast - I used it hard and long and it never waivered. I doubt a Harbor Freight "special" would of held up to the abuse I put it through - I also doubt it would of worked as efficiently.

When you get to the pictures of where I built a new hatch from scratch, take a look at how I cut the wood - with the 45* edges - to help the 1708 biaxial lay nicely. I actually did a little experiment with my large floor hatch when I re-cored it. I did something a little out of the ordinary. Instead of marine plywood, another option is using special foam such as Divinycell or Coosa. These are structural foam core boards and made specifically for this purpose. The big benefit to these is lighter weight and, most importantly, they'll outlast both your boat and you. I used the generic, pink insulation foam that you can buy at Home Depot. In writing that post, it turns out someone else (Dale1) has also used the stuff. Now, I have to emphasize that this foam is NOT made, nor recommended, for use in this way. The results and how long it lasts is completely on you. I used it because I wasn't too concerned about having to redo it if it didn't last as this is an easy project and I could have it done in just a few hours. Here's the link to that post, which also shows a little more detail on recoring a hatch -- viewtopic.php?f=3&t=21367&p=132288&hilit=foam&sid=f7533b275fd17947967e8791f012b16a#p132288

Hope this helps!

 

[TonyD]

Thanks, Dennis! Very informative stuff and I did look over the thread... been working on this all day.. and now as it seems, I ruined the piece.. I went right through it with the Dremel...

That said, what is the best way to fix what I damaged? Or do I just get some plywood - resin the hell out of it.. some non-skid paint, etc... :bang

 

[DennisG01]

That ain't that bad. You can be rough with it, but you still need to gentle - if you know what I mean. You have to sort of "feel" the difference (through the tool) between wood and glass. Did you have the tool at too high of an angle?

Just tape over the topside before you do the epoxing. The first coat of epoxy that you paint on will seep down into the crack - you can even manually open the crack a bit to make sure it seeps in. Once you're all done on the bottom side, you can make the top side look pretty again (and protect the epoxy from UV) by filling in low spots and then topcoating with either paint or a gelcoat repair kit. You can try and match the non-skid if you want (check the stickies at the top of the forum posts), but that's just aesthetics.

Be sure to have a perfectly flat work surface to do the main repair on. I mean PERFECTLY - not "it's good enough" - perfectly flat. Otherwise it will be twisted and won't sit level with the floor, all the way around.

 

[TonyD]

Yeah, that's exactly what happened, angled the dremel too high trying to get under a stubborn piece of wood skin (the onion!). I did sense something was not right and I stopped and then looked underneath and found the damage I did. It just took me a little bit too long to realize the error.

BTW, what kind of epoxy should I use, anything that is recommended?

 

[TonyD]

Instead of marine plywood, another option is using special foam such as Divinycell or Coosa. These are structural foam core boards and made specifically for this purpose. The big benefit to these is lighter weight and, most importantly, they'll outlast both your boat and you.

regarding this, I think I might want to go this path for the core instead of the plywood. Is there an advantage over Divinycell or Coosa and vice versa? Also, how easy is the foam to cut (since it's foam I'd imagine pretty easy?)