Ride Balance Changed After a Rough Trip

[Mike1234]

I just came back from a rough trip to the Bahamas and now I have to use 2-3 bars of trim to keep the ride level with just me on it. I never had to use the trim before to keep level. The trim tabs have been checked and calibrated so it’s not that. It’s a 2017 336 Canyon. Anyone have any thoughts? What could have happened?

 

[magicalbill]

Head Scratcher...Since it was a rough trip over a long distance, and the tabs are properly operational, I can only speculate a load shift somewhere aboard causing the list.

Since your utilizing 2-3 bars of trim to compensate, the load shift, (if that's what it is) would have to be of significant weight. It's probably not water in the bilge since water would collect in the center of the hull and not cause the boat to list.

I assume you've poked around to see if anything has indeed shifted or is otherwise amiss?

One thing to check. Stand on the dock and look at the stern. Is she listing at rest? Are one pair of scuppers submerged while the other isn't?

Not much help; sorry. This is a weird one.

 

[Mike1234]

Thanks so much for your response. I agree. This is a tough one. I peeked around the rear hatch where the generator is as well as the forward bilge area and didn’t see anything out of place. It’s listing at rest. At idle and obviously at high speeds. Not really sure what to do. This boat has been so balanced all these years, something has to have shifted that I just cannot see. Heading back Over to Bahamas on Tuesday, and I know this is going to bother me.

 

[seasick]

Call Grady to ask if there is ballast in the forward bilge area. It may have shifted.
It could be water too. Does the hull sit lower in the water at rest than earlier. To tell with the list you need to measure the distance from the rub rail to the water line for both sides and average the two numbers. The result would then be compared to 'normal' which you may or may not know
Another scarier though is that a fuel tank shifted but you should be able to check that through the deck access plates

 

[Mike1234]

I just sent Grady a note and wrote back quick. They only put weight in the 330 and 370 Express models due to a slight port list. There “shouldn’t” be any in the 336 Canyon. I checked my fuel tank and luckily it’s still in the same spot dead center of the access lids. Also aft and forward bilge areas are dry. And yes. Even at rest slight list to port. Then at idle more noticeable, then very noticeable on plane. I’m at a loss and I’m not crazy. It all happened after my last crossing in 6-8ft chop.

 

[loubeer]

Weird one?!?! I normally run my 330 250 Yamahas at 2 bars for best efficiency at speed and use the trim tabs to level the boat port/starboard. You said the trim tabs were "calibrated". If so, the following may have already been done.

The trim sensors on the engines are spring loaded mechanical device and have been known to stick and show no trim on the gauges when, indeed, you are trimmed (depending on your motors, this sensor may now be electronic). You might manually move the sensor mechanisms to see if they are moving freely. If sticking, a shot of silicone lubricant will free them up.

Another thought is to move the engines up and down in your slip and watch the trim readings on your gauges to determine if trim sensors are working properly.

Admittedly, a longshot - but easy to check.

 

[Mike1234]

Thanks for the tip. I actually just serviced the boat when I got back and had the sensor mechanisms lubed up and engine trims work great. I really wish that was the problem. Easy fix.

 

[SkunkBoat]

of course , very hard to comment without being on the boat but...
"Even at rest slight list to port. Then at idle more noticeable, then very noticeable on plane. I’m at a loss and I’m not crazy. It all happened after my last crossing in 6-8ft chop."

this sounds to me like its not a weight problem but either a trim tab, motor trim, motor torque(props/skeg), running bottom problem because it increases with speed and when on plane. ( and you checked for obvious weigh shifting) Have you had the boat out of the water? Have you been in the water looking?

 

[glacierbaze]

Have you looked to make sure both trim tabs are fully retracted? I agree with Skunkboat, that it sounds like a running gear issue, however, that would not explain a noticeable list at rest. Only a weight shift would cause that, in my opinion.

 

[Mike1234]

of course , very hard to comment without being on the boat but...
"Even at rest slight list to port. Then at idle more noticeable, then very noticeable on plane. I’m at a loss and I’m not crazy. It all happened after my last crossing in 6-8ft chop."

this sounds to me like its not a weight problem but either a trim tab, motor trim, motor torque(props/skeg), running bottom problem because it increases with speed and when on plane. ( and you checked for obvious weigh shifting) Have you had the boat out of the water? Have you been in the water looking?

Yes, I just actually put it back in the water Friday. I am heading back to the Bahamas on Tuesday. I pulled it out to service a few minor things, but mainly for them to check my trim tabs and engine trim because that’s exactly what I thought it was. Everything on the trim tabs and engine trim was great. They even recalibrated my trim tab indicators just to be sure. They are fully operational all the way in/out. The only thing we didn't check was engine torque. Although all three engines were synced and are always synced at the same rpm, and I purposely was paying close attention to that. I check all of my props, and they look good as well. I will likely have to pull it back out when I get back from the Bahamas and keep looking. It’s just very annoying and strange that all of a sudden this we’ll balanced tank is needing trim to run even.

 

[Mike1234]

Have you looked to make sure both trim tabs are fully retracted? I agree with Skunkboat, that it sounds like a running gear issue, however, that would not explain a noticeable list at rest. Only a weight shift would cause that, in my opinion.

Yes. Both fully retracted and looked at by my service guys. I brought it in mainly for that because that was my immediate thought as well. Engine trim looked at as well. Nothing.

 

[SirGrady226]

If it has a list just sitting in the water, it has to be extra weight on the one side. Not sure if the bumpy ride could of caused water to soak in through an area where the motors are mounted or somewhere else and add the weight. It would have to be a significant amount, sure doesn't seem plausible but nothing else seems obvious.

 

[Mike1234]

If it has a list just sitting in the water, it has to be extra weight on the one side. Not sure if the bumpy ride could of caused water to soak in through an area where the motors are mounted or somewhere else and add the weight. It would have to be a significant amount, sure doesn't seem plausible but nothing else seems obvious.

Very odd. I’m at a loss myself.

 

[Hookup1]

Did the "list" start immediately or did it get progressively worse? Seems like a lot of water in that outboard compartment. Were the bilges checked underway? What about the bilge pumps? Are they "lit" on the panel so you can tell if they are running? Maybe a thru hull broken for a fish box cutoff or some other one. A 3 hour run at speed could push a lot of water into one side.

 

[Mike1234]

Did the "list" start immediately or did it get progressively worse? Seems like a lot of water in that outboard compartment. Were the bilges checked underway? What about the bilge pumps? Are they "lit" on the panel so you can tell if they are running? Maybe a thru hull broken for a fish box cutoff or some other one. A 3 hour run at speed could push a lot of water into one side.

It started pretty immediately after a the crossing when I actually had to use the tabs in a big head sea. That’s why I thought maybe one of the tabs got stuck down a few centimeters but both have been checked and calibrated since I got back. As for that forward bilge area that has some water, it has always had water since day one. Bad design per Grady. Never has more never has less.

 

[magicalbill]

As I mentioned in my reply above, I don't see how it can be water. Any water in the bilge would naturally settle amidship, or in the middle of the bilge. This would not cause a list.

I just read Hookup1's thought. I suppose one of the fish boxes or livewells could've filled, but I'm assuming you checked that.

 

[Mike1234]

As I mentioned in my reply above, I don't see how it can be water. Any water in the bilge would naturally settle amidship, or in the middle of the bilge. This would not cause a list.

I just read Hookup1's thought. I suppose one of the fish boxes or livewells could've filled, but I'm assuming you checked that.

I’m with you! That’s why I’m puzzled.

 

[Mike1234]

I’m with you! That’s why I’m puzzled.

And yes. Fish boxes and live wells dry

 

[SkunkBoat]

again, not easy to make a comment without being there but..my thoughts (in my imagination...)

I'm dismissing the "slight list at rest" as a red herring. He seems to be describing the boat heeling under power. Also, we can assume he checked for shifted weight and livewell/fishboxes full of water. In my experience, nothing on my boat can shift enough to make me lean except passengers or a cooler on deck. Everything else is bound by bulkheads/compartments. The amount of water that would have to shift outside the stringers is a lot and you would think it would run back to the bilge. Is it possible that there is hidden trapped water that shifts to outside the stringer when under power?

My similar experience was caused by trim tabs not being where I thought they were and not retracting all the way. Also, if I get on plane with motors way down, I will heel over.

 

[Mike1234]

again, not easy to make a comment without being there but..my thoughts (in my imagination...)

I'm dismissing the "slight list at rest" as a red herring. He seems to be describing the boat heeling under power. Also, we can assume he checked for shifted weight and livewell/fishboxes full of water. In my experience, nothing on my boat can shift enough to make me lean except passengers or a cooler on deck. Everything else is bound by bulkheads/compartments. The amount of water that would have to shift outside the stringers is a lot and you would think it would run back to the bilge. Is it possible that there is hidden trapped water that shifts to outside the stringer when under power?

My similar experience was caused by trim tabs not being where I thought they were and not retracting all the way. Also, if I get on plane with motors way down, I will heel over.

I really appreciate all of this dialogue, truly. After checking all compartments, I found nothing. Even if it were a stringer that was misplaced, there is not or has never been enough water to make it shift enough to need 2-3 bars on one side. As I said, this boat rode even as could be the last 4 years. Motors all the way down or not. Straight as arrow. Like you, I truly believe it’s the trim tabs, but I had the boat out and both are fully retracted and working perfectly. All engines trimmed down all the way. Unless one motor kicks up while under way, that could be a possibility, but I checked that as well. They seem to be sitting solid. I know this is not an easy diagnosis, but it’s frustrating that it happened so quickly and not noticeable by the eye or by any of the obvious items we discussed. Maybe I’ll find out more on Tuesday when I head back over. If I’m lucky, maybe it fixes itself (doubt it). I’ll just have to pull it back out when I get back from the islands and troubleshoot more closely.