SAILFISH RE-POWER-OPTION or NOT

[GradyGEO]

I am going through the painful decision process that I’m sure many of you have participated in. I talking about the old re-power, re-purchase dilemma. I own a 2000 Sailfish 272 with twin Yamaha 225 OX66 Saltwater Series engines. The boat is in very good condition and I have replaced basically everything that could break. The engines run well, and everyone I’ve talked to or has serviced them rave about them. But they’re not for me. I say that only because of how I use the boat. Fishing in Ft Lauderdale, with the exception of chasing dolphin or running to the Bahamas, is basically a short ride to the reef. Once there you either drop or troll. Then there is the ICW, which by me is almost entirely a no wake zone.

I have looked at ETECS, YAMMIES, VERADOS and SUZUKIS. I believe them all to be good engines and have mentally categorized them as follows:

ETEC’s
NOT FOR ME, no more two strokes that love to run, meaning fast.

YAMMIES
2nd BEST, MOST EXPENSIVE, SMARTEST CHOICE FOR A GRADY Never heard anything bad about them

VERADOS
THE BEST, 2nd MOST EXPENSIVE, HEAVIEST and probably NOT THE BEST CHOICE FOR A GRADY but everyone I’ve talked to loves them or wants them. SWEET CONTROLS TOO.

SUZUKIS
PROVEN, LEAST EXPENSIVE, SERVICING PROBLEMS IN THE PAST.

If I eliminate the ETECS, and go with anything other than the SUZUKIS, I will have so much money in the boat that I could probably buy a newer used boat with newer used engines. I can go on and on, but suffice it to say that resale must always be considered.

So until now, this has basically been my logic, but I would love to hear from the forum. Please feel free to critic or confirm my findings. All comments will be greatly appreciated.

 

[Bama96]

What does you closet dealer sell? Who will service your engines and what do they work on? I say buy the ones that you can get worked on at a local shop and have a relationship with. They all will have a problem at some point. I still believe Yamaha 4 strokes will bring the most at resale time on a Grady.

 

[Bob's Cay]

looks like you have two decisions to make, to repower or not and then which brand.

As for the first decision, it usually boils down to how long do you plan to keep your boat. If you are happy with the hull and do not plan to trade up or down for several years then a repower makes more sense. You are better off recouping the cost of new engines through use rather than resale.

I use that train of thought when I repowered back in '02 and have been very pleased I did. My boat was (and still is) in good shape and fit my needs. I knew I did not plan to trade for several years. The engine now has 6 years and 460 hours of use and I feel I am well positioned as far as cost of repower.

And I did choose Yamaha.

 

[Grog]

Don't the F250's have the fly by wire?

If you're only getting rid the the OX's because they smell and use a little more gas it's kind of hard to justify $33K (or more). The 225 Verados are pigs, they can't shave off 75 pounds somewhere? There used to be issues with the lower units failing but that may be fixed and it may be from them being barked all the time. Don't expect the same power from a F225 as what you have now but you may not need it. They're quiet at idle (possibly too quiet) when cruising they're quieter but not that much. People rave about the Zukes but the dealer network is the worst, but you may have more options in Florida.

You're going to take a bath on resale with either option so don't weigh that too much when considering.

 

[GradyGEO]

Bama, Very good point. The closest dealer is the SUZUKI/ETEC dealer. They are only 20 min. by water. But living in Ft Lauderdale basically means that I’m within 20-30min. of anything by trailer. I’m with you on the Yammie’s being better for resale.

Bob, Yes you’re right about the two decisions, which has added to the confusion for me. This is a big decision. I love my boat. It is the perfect boat for me and my family. I run it alone sometimes and have the kids and wife on sometimes. Yes, I would like a generator and a bigger cabin, but I certainly don’t need them. I don’t see myself trading up any time soon, and I would only be trading down if I had to. I guess I'm a little concerned about the longevity of the hull as I have read some nasty stuff with some older boats on this forum.

The Yammie’s are 10K more expensive than the Suzuki’s. Assuming that the Suzuki’s are as good as the Yammie’s, which I'm still trying to establish, is it sacrilegious to waiver from the Yammie/Grady package? I know it’s a head thing, but will it also be a head thing for the next guy?

 

[CJBROWN]

Suzuki's -- hands down.
If you can get service for them (or DIY) go for the best buy. They are highly rated and I have yet to read anywhere on any forum where owners didn't like them.

As far as justifying the cost, the only way to get around that would be to find a couple of used F225's. That might prove impossible, and by the time you get them installed it may not be worth the savings from just going new, with new warranties, etc.

If it were me, dunno. Probably sell the boat and get something newer. A 2000 model isn't that old though, and if it's been well maintained, which it sounds like it has, you may not gain anything in a replacement. So I would not worry about it's integrity, longevity. Keep that transom sealed up good, right?

Another way to look at justifying the cost of repower: if you were to pick out a boat to replace it with, something you really like, something that fullfills your needs and desires - what would it cost you to do that? Now, what could you get out of what you have? Then take the difference and factor in how much those new motors cost in comparison. That may help answer the question of 'do I or don't I". Do you want what you have for the investment in motors, or would something else serve you better? I'm with the others, selling a repower may net you back 50-60% of that cost. If you're talking $30K+ that could be a fifteen thousand loss. But then anything newer may depreciate the same amount in a few short years anyway.

 

[GradyGEO]

Grog...I should have been more specific. I am looking at the 250's for all being considered. And yes, the 250's do come with the electronic controls. I have not heard anything about them though, nor Suzuki's. Thank you for the comment on the Verado's.

CJ...Thank you for your input as well. I'm am doing the math and it may just make more sense to repurchase if I can get one of these great deals that I hear are out there. I didn't post this before but my boat was a double leftover. It was registered in 2002, but that really doesn't help me on the resale or trade-in. I'm starting to look more closely at what's available now.

I am happy to see that the comments on the Suzuki's are positive so far.

 

[GradyGEO]

Grog...Just thought you would like to know that your comment about the Verado 225's being pigs was confirmed. My friend who made the jump from the Opti's to the Verado's told me that he was getting BETTER fuel economy with the Opti's. He does love the Verado's, but was sadly disappointed.

 

[NOTHING ELSE MATTERS]

Personally i would stay away from Suzuki(their customer service and warranty really stinks, also problems with some of their motors), also i would stay away from e-tec(some problems reported with blown heads), Verado is a great motor as long as you have trained mechanics working on them(if not, saty away), Yamaha would be my best choice(a huge dealer network and great custome service/warranty). I did owned a 2001 optimax and it was a very very good motor, i had it for 5 years and never saw a mechanic, not even for oil maitenance.

 

[magicalbill]

I have no experience with the 250's but my Yamaha 200 4-strokes run flawlessly.
As long as they put out engines with this kind of hi-level operation and a huge service/dealer network I will never buy any other outboard ever.

 

[Gman25]

As long as they put out engines with this kind of hi-level operation and a huge service/dealer network I will never buy any other outboard ever.

Couldnt agree more. Yammie guy forever!...and I do have experience with the F250's...they are simply remarkable.

2005 300 Marlin w/F250's

 

[Gman25]

GradyGEO, think long and hard about repowering or not. If you know you are going to keep the boat for sure then I would consider a repower while you can probably get a few bucks for your current engines. If you repower then sell in a few years you will not make back the money you put into it. I can speak from experience when I repowered my 88 sailfish in 02 with new 200 HPDI's then traded it in 05 I got crushed.If I would have held the money for the repower and sold my boat as it was I would have had an extra 20k in the bank............Good luck.

2005 300 Marlin w/F250's

 

[Capt Armchair]

Regarding Zukes, if you have a great mechanic and want to keep the price down, they are solid 4 stroke motors, if less glamorous.

Personally, I would go with the Yamaha 225's you save several thousand under the 250 price and the power difference will not be appreciablte in that boat unless it is flat seas. I have 225's on the larger 30' marlin and they plane and push it with absolutely no problems at all.

 

[Parthery]

You will never recover the $30K to repower....at the end of the day, people will look at the boat and say - its a 9 or 10 or 12 year old hull.

I once repowered an Aquasport CC....even with a 5 year old motor, it was on a 17 year old hull...I won't do that again.

Additionally, some changes were made (I think in '02?) to accomodate the heavier weight of the 4 strokes. You may run into scupper issues, etc...with the additional weight on your 2000.

Sell yours..take the same $30K...find a newer one with 4 stroke power...and enjoy....

 

[Greg B]

Mike at Outboard Specialties in Pompano will set you up with a pair of Zukes and take good care of you on service as well.

 

[GradyGEO]

Gonna call Mike just to see if he has a deal he wants to make. But if not, and after reading through all of these wise comments, perhaps the smart thing to do is to keep the boat and engines I have for now.

If I NEEDED to repower I would probably go with the Suzuki's strickly because of the cost difference between the Yammies, and the fact that they are both great engines. But I don't NEED to repower...I WANT to repower. Don't get me wrong, if money were not the issue (and it almost always is) I would buy the F250's with the elctronic controls and be done with it. My boat is in very good condition and I know what I have, but it is a 2000. I can't deny the fact that it will always be viewed as such. Who knows what the next couple of years are going to bring, and I can always sell or trade it. But once the investment on new engines is made, its done. Thank you all for the comments.

 

[Greg B]

I bought a used Suzuki 300 and repowered my 2000 Islander last year. Definitely a great engine.

 

[jekyl]

Suzuki's have an excellent rep here as does Yamaha. Mercury other than Opti's not so good.

I have just repowered and ended up with F225's.

The 250's were $10,000 more. Impossible to justify on a used boat.Suzuki 225 were about the same price as Yammie and Honda's.

Yamaha and my dealer were the keenest to make it happen best trade-in and free first service and props of my choice.

I trailer, and at this stage haven't moved the scuppers. We have not noticed any more water coming on board but if I was moored it would be a must do.

I hated spending that much money.....but I have to say once it was done " I'm very happy" I think it's well worth it for the peace of mind, and the peace of fishing with four strokes. They are also more green so that eases my conscience about the carbon burn.

Here in Australia 2 strokes on big boats are dead so I believe I have really added to the desirability of the package as a saleable item. And I really want to go out in the boat again. Previous motor problems were really detracting from the boating experience.

 

[BobP]

Unless I missed it, you didn't say how long you intend to keep the boat after repowering.
So how can you be concerned with resale value?

People who repower new and and sell soon, don't care about resale value even if they say so. Juts like people who buy new cars and sell in a few years.

The motors will drop to half price in less than three yrs, irrespective of hrs, and only if you sell motors alone, not with boat. If you go Verados on a Grady, will be worth-less as a boat for sale.

So if you go the repower route, keep the old motors pickled in the garage, then sell the new motors alone, then have the old motors back on boat for sale.

This is if you really care about resale and not just saying you do.

 

[RUMBLEFISH]

I would get a set of 200 yamaha hpdi's and they would push that boat with ease. Great on gas use little oil and all your controls would fit and I bet you could get a great deal.

But if your hell bent on going 4 stroke the yamaha it should be me thinks. :wink: