Stern Eye Damage.. Is it rotten?

[gopack2013]

Hey all, this is the only questionable damage to a 1997 247 advance I am looking at tomorrow on the Starbord Side. This damage was probably from lifting the boat for bottom paint and I and the seller have no idea how old it is... The seller just sent it to me and my concern is that this is absolutely a water/moisture entry point for the transom. This is a 97 hull so it would be Greenwood XL for what that matters, just seems to me that its rot or weak from delamination.

I have a hired surveyor coming with me tomorrow to view it/seatrial/moisture check and I am frankly thinking about calling it off and moving on. Thoughts? Is it worth it to still pay for the full inspection? I know of two families Grady's that have had rot around Eyelets repaired, one 26 had to have a full transom rebuild, and water spreads....

The spider cracks in the deck I am not too worried about.

Would appreciate any thoughts or feedback. Thanks guys.

 

[seasick]

Can't tell just by the pics if the damage to do to overload ( very fixable) or core softness ( could mean big problems).
Your surveyor should be able to tell.

 

[gopack2013]

Thanks so much man. Hoping its overload, looks like i'm going to still look at it. Will post pics of the result and repair if needed.

 

[Mustang65fbk]

Although I’m by no means an expert, I’d disagree about not being able to tell from the pictures the reason for the damage. If you look below the stern eye you’ll see a water/rust trail going downward, which is imo very much an indicator of water seeping out of the stern eye. Unless the boat is a steal or you don’t mind spending your time and money on a survey and so forth, then I’d walk away and not even bother with the survey. Most sellers know how damage occurred to their boat, whether it was caused by them or the previous owner and so forth, of which it sounds like he just doesn’t want to tell you want happened imo. Because it was either he that did the damage, or a previous owner, of which I’m sure the current seller would’ve likely noticed the issue when he bought the boat. Which if it was a previous owner he’d likely say something like “the previous owner says it happened while trailering the boat” or “it happened when lifting the boat off the trailer to bottom paint it”, or whatever the story is.

The fact that he doesn’t at least have some idea as to how it happened makes me think he caused the issue and doesn’t want to disclose that information to you, of which would make me think that if he doesn’t want to be honest about that, what else is he not being honest about? The issues that aren’t visible from the surface and that could be structural, or potential issues with the motors or electrical and so forth. I’d pass or offer him considerably less, dependent upon the actual condition of the boat and if you want to deal with the repairs or potential project on your own. I also don’t imagine the damage would be from lifting the boat as the two stern eyes as well as the bow eye should support the weight of the boat just fine and without any issues. Unless of course there was previous damage to them or water intrusion around those areas as well. To me, it sounds like the water intrusion into the stern was what caused the issue and if that’s the case then I imagine there will be other issues with the boat as well.

 

[Hookup1]

FoIlow what your surveyor recommends. I had a similar problem on my 1997 268 Islander. The ring has a shiny peened flat. Probably caused by some impact (concrete dock piling?). The transom has enough give to adsorb the impact but the gelcoat doesn't. The transom moved and cracked the gelcoat above.

I had no idea how it happened or when. Could have happened before I bought the boat 15 years ago.

I just finished repairing the corner. Replaced coring behind rub rail with marine plywood. Reinforced epoxy and glass. Transom core is fine. I'll touch up the gelcoat on the ring or re-caulk. It's not in the water and sealed up.

 

[Ekea]

are you sure its greenwood? when i spoke with grady, i am almost 100% positive they told me they 98 was when they started using it.

id call them and double check if i were you.

 

[Mustang65fbk]

are you sure its greenwood? when i spoke with grady, i am almost 100% positive they told me they 98 was when they started using it.

id call them and double check if i were you.

I’ve just read about it on the GG site such as this thread, as well as a few others also, but the claim in this particular thread is “1997 on for the transoms and 1998 on for the stringers.”

What are Greenwood Transoms and Why They Don't Rot

Until recently switching to composite, GW had been using Greenwood XL in place of marine plywood since the late 90's. There have been fewer reports of rotted transoms since then. Here is an interesting post from THT where a builder describes what Greenwood is...

www.greatgrady.com

 

[Mustang65fbk]

So did you do the inspection with the surveyor? What was the outcome?

 

[gopack2013]

Good morning,

Mustang, thanks so much for your comments and you were SPOT-ON. Thank you for sharing your institutional knowledge. I went to the boat and had a seatrial, everything looked fantastic and both engines have re-man blocks and new lower units in 2021 with records. Unfortunately, from 2009-2021 the boat had twin 225 Yamaha 4strokes and that is way overpowered for the boat and also caused me concern. The engines on it now are completely re-done and re-wired 1997 150s that have been sitting since 2009 with 209 hrs on original gauges. (Confirmed the Gauges were original)

Overall its a good boat except for the damage on the transom. The surveyor met me at the boat and inspected the transom. The deck and stringers were all solid. the Hull was solid. The boat was predominately used in the Pamlico river which is brackish water but mostly fresh.

There was a 12 inch area around that ring in the picture above that maxed out his moisture meter and he stated that the area must be repaired immediately from the inside and that the transom was wet in that area.

Around the transom there was some delamination but not any moisture. The inspector advised me that the repair would be 2-5 thousand to fix and if it was fixed the delamination should be addressed too. It will be an extremely difficult repair because you have to cut a hole above to access the ring due to the stringers on the bracket obstructing the access. Then after the repair you would have to re-glass that hole, he said a hatch install would be another point for moisture to enter. He said that within 8-10 yrs the transom would have to be repaired with the minor delamination occurring. (most likely from the boat being overpowered)

The asking price was 26K. I was prepared originally to offer 21 and max out at 23. After this information I walked away from the boat and told the owner that if he fixes the damage then I would be interested in getting the surveyor to come out again and inspect the boat but if he wants to sell it to someone go ahead. If he fixes it and the surveyor confirms there is no longer moisture in the transom then I may offer him 19 with a max of 21 knowing the transom will most likely have to be replaced by 2030 if I keep the boat. Overall I am very very happy I paid the inspector for his work and it sure saved me from a lemon purchase. I will keep you updated and sincerely appreciate the help and comments.

Thanks,

Peter

 

[gopack2013]

FoIlow what your surveyor recommends. I had a similar problem on my 1997 268 Islander. The ring has a shiny peened flat. Probably caused by some impact (concrete dock piling?). The transom has enough give to adsorb the impact but the gelcoat doesn't. The transom moved and cracked the gelcoat above.

I had no idea how it happened or when. Could have happened before I bought the boat 15 years ago.

I just finished repairing the corner. Replaced coring behind rub rail with marine plywood. Reinforced epoxy and glass. Transom core is fine. I'll touch up the gelcoat on the ring or re-caulk. It's not in the water and sealed up.

View attachment 26925 View attachment 26926

This is literally identical to what was going on with the grady. Glad to see you were able to repair and fix the issue! That is what caused me to walk away. no idea how long its been and a basketball sized area of moisture was scary for me. That's a thick area of the hull and will take a beating overtime. Glad to see you got it fixed. Looks great!

 

[Mustang65fbk]

Good morning,

Mustang, thanks so much for your comments and you were SPOT-ON. Thank you for sharing your institutional knowledge. I went to the boat and had a seatrial, everything looked fantastic and both engines have re-man blocks and new lower units in 2021 with records. Unfortunately, from 2009-2021 the boat had twin 225 Yamaha 4strokes and that is way overpowered for the boat and also caused me concern. The engines on it now are completely re-done and re-wired 1997 150s that have been sitting since 2009 with 209 hrs on original gauges. (Confirmed the Gauges were original)

Overall its a good boat except for the damage on the transom. The surveyor met me at the boat and inspected the transom. The deck and stringers were all solid. the Hull was solid. The boat was predominately used in the Pamlico river which is brackish water but mostly fresh.

There was a 12 inch area around that ring in the picture above that maxed out his moisture meter and he stated that the area must be repaired immediately from the inside and that the transom was wet in that area.

Around the transom there was some delamination but not any moisture. The inspector advised me that the repair would be 2-5 thousand to fix and if it was fixed the delamination should be addressed too. It will be an extremely difficult repair because you have to cut a hole above to access the ring due to the stringers on the bracket obstructing the access. Then after the repair you would have to re-glass that hole, he said a hatch install would be another point for moisture to enter. He said that within 8-10 yrs the transom would have to be repaired with the minor delamination occurring. (most likely from the boat being overpowered)

The asking price was 26K. I was prepared originally to offer 21 and max out at 23. After this information I walked away from the boat and told the owner that if he fixes the damage then I would be interested in getting the surveyor to come out again and inspect the boat but if he wants to sell it to someone go ahead. If he fixes it and the surveyor confirms there is no longer moisture in the transom then I may offer him 19 with a max of 21 knowing the transom will most likely have to be replaced by 2030 if I keep the boat. Overall I am very very happy I paid the inspector for his work and it sure saved me from a lemon purchase. I will keep you updated and sincerely appreciate the help and comments.

Thanks,

Peter

Always a first time for me being spot-on

A couple of serious thoughts on the matter are that I'd be willing to bet if there's a serious issue like that with the transom then there's probably at least a handful or two of other things on the boat that are going to be problematic like electrical gremlins, other things that don't work, moisture intrusion elsewhere near the cleats, bow railings and so forth. Did you, or the surveyor, explain to the owner that there was moisture damage to the boat and that it would take some pretty extensive repairs to make the boat safe/dependable again? If so, was he willing to negotiate on the price? If you did, and he was still firm on the price then I'm guessing he probably knew about the issue beforehand and wasn't being honest with you about it and again I'd have to assume he knew something about the damage as opposed to just being dumbstruck by it. I agree with the surveyor's ballpark figures on repairs as other members of the forum here have talked about repairing the transoms on their boats and have had figures from that $2k-$5k range on up to over $10k. Which if you're already spending top dollar on the boat to begin with then that could put you upside down on the project very quickly. Lastly, if you're seriously considering buying a boat and feel free to share, I'd tell others on here your location, budget, what kind of boat you want as well as specs so that others can help you in your search. Here's one in Florida that's a year newer for $21.9k, though it doesn't look like it includes a trailer with it. Good luck with your search and keep us informed.

Grady-White 247 Advance boats for sale - Boat Trader

Find Grady-White 247 Advance boats for sale near you, including boat prices, photos, and more. Locate Grady-White boat dealers and find your boat at Boat Trader!

www.boattrader.com

 

[gopack2013]

Thanks for sharing!! I will check it out. I am in Eastern NC and looking for CC or WA grady's or contenders in the 24-28 foot range. I just sold my boat and my budget is 28, if you know of any feel free to let me know.

Thanks!

Peter

 

[gopack2013]

UPDATE:

After I walked away over 5 weeks ago, I just got a call from the owner and he drilled the transom to find it completely rotten. He has paid to have the transom completely rebuilt over the next 6 weeks and the motors re-rigged. He said he would provide photos. I will be sure to share as they come in. I appreciate all of your insight. Finding a good hull is difficult!

 

[Hookup1]

I was quoted $10,000 for a job like that.

If you are looking at older GW's (mine included) it's just a matter of time before the transom will have to be re-done. Difficult to keep them completely dry. If the repair is being done by a good shop this may be an opportunity to buy a boat with a known good transom.

 

[gopack2013]

Progress. Motors de-rigged and first incision made.

 

[gopack2013]

Old stringers look to be nice and dry so far

 

[greauxpete]

What's the latest?

 

[Fishtales]

I believe it is fine. I've seen that type of stain on many boats and it is due to stainless weeping a bit.

 

[SkunkBoat]

Old stringers look to be nice and dry so far

kind of makes you wish you didn't cut them?