Tilt/trim motor intermittent

[coldpizza]

When I went to tilt my motors to down position, the port side motor didn't move, the starboard worked normally. I checked voltage and was fine. I tried it on my other battery bank and still didn't tilt. I talk the cowling of the engine and could hear a click when trying to tilt. Not a clicking like you might get with a low battery and trying to start one.
My and another person manually moved the motor to down position and it ran fine. When I got back, thinking I was going to have a problem, the motor tilted up no problem.
Anbody have any ideas? I am not ruling out a battery problem (they are 2 years old). I checked all connections I can see to make sure no loose connections. an outboard mechanic I respect said it could be the tilt motor may be going bad. It is a $600-700 OEM part and since it is an intermittent problem, I'm have gotten a new one just yet.
Any ideas would be appreciated.
Thanks.
Len

 

[DennisG01]

When I went to tilt my motors to down position, the port side motor didn't move, the starboard worked normally. I checked voltage and was fine. I tried it on my other battery bank and still didn't tilt. I talk the cowling of the engine and could hear a click when trying to tilt. Not a clicking like you might get with a low battery and trying to start one.
My and another person manually moved the motor to down position and it ran fine. When I got back, thinking I was going to have a problem, the motor tilted up no problem.
Anbody have any ideas? I am not ruling out a battery problem (they are 2 years old). I checked all connections I can see to make sure no loose connections. an outboard mechanic I respect said it could be the tilt motor may be going bad. It is a $600-700 OEM part and since it is an intermittent problem, I'm have gotten a new one just yet.
Any ideas would be appreciated.
Thanks.
Len

If it "wasn't" a click like you get when starting an engine... what WAS it like? That would help more

Did it then trim down fine?

Where did you check for V?

Need much more detail.

Sounds more like a relay issue, though. Check for power on both sides.

 

[Fishtales]

I'd try the button that moves both. If both are intermittent, then look at the switch. Likely one moves, the other maybe not. Then try the individual switches on the binnacle and then on each motor. Many times, you can remove the binacle cover and spray the switches with CRC or WD to get the moisture out. Sometimes just working the switches solves the issue.

 

[Mustang65fbk]

Next time you have the motors up, check the trim/tilt fluid reservoir and see if you're running low on it. I had a similar issue where I'd press the button, both at the helm as well as at the motor, and you'd hear the motor spinning but it wouldn't want to go up or down all the way. I manually lifted the motor all the way up, locked it into place, checked the trim/tilt fluid reservoir and realized that the fluid level was very low. I'm guessing I have a small leak from somewhere as it shouldn't evaporate or get used up, from what I understand. I called up the local GW dealership here and they said "I'd keep filling it up until it stops working or breaks, then replace it". So, I filled it up with extra trim/tilt fluid, ran it up and down a few times to where it worked consistently, and haven't had an issue with it again, and that was back in June. I plan to add trim/tilt fluid, or at least check it before the start of every season just to make sure it's full from here on out since there was an issue.

 

[Sardinia306Canyon]

I have the same problem on my port F300.
The trim motor works as i can hear it running but engine tilts down only to the trim rams and get stuck there even if the trim mootor is running, but if i push on the cowling then engine lowers normally.
This happen every now and then, always after i did not lowered the engines for more than a week or more what is probably the outboard telling me that he's bored and i need to boat more...

My guess is that the tilt/trim tube is not greased well and sticks and as soon i have her out of the water i will verify and grease it.

I few weeks ago was working in my buddies ship yard helping his son to fix a outboard with a binding turning tube and greasing did not solved the problem. On my suggestion we used a heat gun and heated carefully the tube to solve the old grease inside and voilà, the old grease plug dissolved and we could fill the tube with fresh grease.
The other and last solution would be injecting CRC or WD40 in the tube what will dissolve the grease plug as well, but the remaining WD40 will dissolve the fresh grease too so in case the WD40 has to pushed out what need a lot of fresh grease.

Chris

 

[Sdfish]

I'm with Dennis - try switching the relays in the motor and see if works.

 

[Sardinia306Canyon]

When the trim motor is not running to release the pressure a tilted up a outboard will not lower when pushing it, thats why they stay tilted up without safety latch. They can be lowered only when opening the release screw on the side of the outboard bracket, thats why this valve exist. It can happen also if the pressure valve inside is leaking, but then the outboard will lower slowly when not on the safety locks.

As far i remember the local mechanic in Costa Rica fixed non or intermittent running trim motors by installing new carbons/brushes, that is much cheaper than new trim motors.

Low trim oil makes a particular squealing noise when motor is running and tries to tilt up the engine, that happens first on tilting and then later with really low oil when trimming. However, with the engine on the safety lock a check for a full reservoir is never bad. If you need to fill up then do this several times, tilt up and down and recheck in between till oil level don't lower anymore. Filling once is mostly not enough.

@coldpizza
The trim motor was not turning at all?
Could you push the outboard down pushing on the cowling or the lower unit?
Did you opened the release valve?

Chris

 

[DennisG01]

Chris - he stated he only gets a clicking noise... no motor noise is made.

 

[gbgrady208]

I just had a similar problem on my dual 300's and it turned out that the rubber rub pads were warped out by growth that got between the rubber and the metal. These were replaced when the boat was out for service and no issues since then. They were essentially binding on the rubber pads and evidently this is not uncommon if bottom growth gets in there.

 

[Sardinia306Canyon]

Chris - he stated he only gets a clicking noise... no motor noise is made.

Yes, i read that.
I just want to make sure as i wonder how he could lower the outboard with a non turning trim motor and not opening the release valve (what they probably did). As you already wrote, without further informations it's difficult to understand a problem and give specific answers so i usually ask to exclude misunderstandings.

If the trim motor is not turning and the relay is clicking then it's either a bad relay what can be rather easily measured or applied 12V to one of the +12V connectors or the carbons are used and they can be replaced if the mechanic is willing and able to do that.
However, testing intermittent problems are usually prone to fail as they normally just don't happen when testing, kinda of Murphys law.

Not knowing more that they seem to be Yamaha 200's i don't know if Yamaha has them as replacement parts or if the mechanic need to measure the dimension of the carbons, get the correct ones for car alternator and solder them. Thats what's normal done in Costa Rica and i had this done several times and it lasted surprisingly long time.

Yes, swapping the two relays between the engines may be a rather simple solution to see if problem shifts to the other outboard, same for the trim motors but pulling them that can be a complicated depending on the outboard model.

BTW: another important detail to know: does the trim/tilt only makes troubles to go down, or does the same happen when tilting up?

Chris

 

[DennisG01]

Yes, i read that.
I just want to make sure as i wonder how he could lower the outboard with a non turning trim motor and not opening the release valve (what they probably did). As you already wrote, without further informations it's difficult to understand a problem and give specific answers so i usually ask to exclude misunderstandings.

I "assumed" when he said "manually" moved the engine he used the release valve... but good point - maybe he just pushed the engine really hard!

But, yeah, more detail is important otherwise we end up just typing for no reason or going around in circles

 

[seasick]

The OP didn't say if he was pressing the switch while 'pushing very hard'.
What also would have helped is if he had tried to tilt the motor down a bit after he was able to tilt it all the way up.
Finally, since he heard a click when he pressed the switch, there is no reason to suspect a battery issue. A dead spot on the trim motor is a possibility but so is a bad relay. Tapping it firmly while pressing the switch would help to see if the relay is the issue.

 

[glacierbaze]

Disconnect the Blue and green wires from the tilt motor at the relay. Ground your multimeter to the black post, you should have 12 V on red, zero on blue and green. When you hit the up switch, you should have 12 V on blue and zero on green. When you hit the down switch, you should have 12 V on green, and zero on blue.
Anything else, you have a short or a stuck relay.
How many wires coming out of the tilt motor, two or four?

 

[Sdfish]

good advice above!

 

[Irish eyes]

Same problem, tapped the trim motor and motor will trim up and down. Going to replace trim motor this winter

 

[coldpizza]

View attachment 35306

Disconnect the Blue and green wires from the tilt motor at the relay. Ground your multimeter to the black post, you should have 12 V on red, zero on blue and green. When you hit the up switch, you should have 12 V on blue and zero on green. When you hit the down switch, you should have 12 V on green, and zero on blue.
Anything else, you have a short or a stuck relay.
How many wires coming out of the tilt motor, two or four?

 

[coldpizza]

Thanks for the picture and description. I used the release screw to lower the unit. The boat has set for 3 weeks when I went to tilt it down when it would move. I used both the common trim/tilt switch on the throttle lever and the individual switches (port and starboard) at the binnacle. I could not hear any noise, just no movement on the port motor (starboard motor worked fine). I also tried using the switch at the motor and that didn't work. I friend nearby should be how to release the hydralics to move it to a low position. I used it the rest of the day like that. 40 miles and a couple of hours, got back to the dock and tried it, and all worked normally. A Yamaha mechanic I know said the motor is not really repairable, so if that is the problem, the motor assembly has to be replaced. I will check the voltage if it happens again. Thanks for all the advice, and sory it took me a while to respond.
Len

 

[seasick]

If the tilt motor was bad or dead, you should still hear the trim/tilt relays clicking.
The first thing I would do is examine, disconnect, clean and reinstall all the cables that connect to the tilt relays including the fat cables.
In addition, locate the main fat ground wire (black usually) that runs from the battery switch to the motor and inspect the motor end connection which will be a stud or bolt and nut that connects the cable to the powerhead.

 

[Mustang65fbk]

Have you checked the fluid level in the reservoir? I would start with the basics first and go from there.

 

[49pan]

I have to ask how in the hell do you fill the reservoir. The hole is only about 5/16.