what to do with an old fixer-upper? FIX IT UP!

[love2fish]

Heres the story. My father bought this used boat, 18' grady white with a 150hp Johnson outboard, way back when i was in grammer school. We used it a bunch of times and it was alot of fun. The engine had tons of problems and eventually he said to hell with it. Its been sitting in my backyard on the trailer for about 15 years, unused. Someone had given us a Force 120hp motor for it quite a few years back but nobody ever got around to doing anything about it so that just sat in the garage collecting dust.

i'm 27 now. I finally convinced my father to let me do something with it. Its was covered the entire time until i opened it up last week. There was a TON of carpenter ants running allover the place and i basically ripped all of the upholstery off of it (rotting) and got rid of the carpet too. I uncovered a huge nest of carpenter ant egg casings and such, nasty! All i've done so far is removed all that stuff and vaccumed out all the stuff that was in it (somehow a whole bunch of leaves got in there, maybe the tarp ripped?) Anyhoo when i opened the 'new' engine, it was beautiful and clean. I'd say whoever owned it before probably only used it a handfull of times. 10 times tops. Me and my buddy installed it on the boat (i'm never doign that with only one other person again!) and hooked it all up, got rid of the old gas that was sitting there for 10 plus years, started it up, it took some ether at first but once it got going it ran really well. So thats where i'm at, got a good engine on an old ratty boat.

I have a few concerns and questions. What kind of damage can all of those carpenter ants do to a fiberglass boat? Is there wood inside it holding the deck up? The deck is really soft in some places but it still seems really sturdy. It does not feel like anyone is goign to fall through but theres definitely play in it in a few places. My friends seem to think i should take a circular saw to the deck 'just to see whats in there'. I'm very hesitant about doing this and dont really want to incur all of the extra costs (money and time) that may be involved in fixing a hole like that. I'm looking to keep this relatively low budget. I'm already looking at probably having to replace the steering system. I've already bought a book, a couple batteries, and a new fuel system. My total is still under $200 but with that steering system i'll probably be up to about $350 and i've still gotta buy paint because i dont want carpet in the thing anymore. I'm goign to paint the inside of it and the floor with that grippy type stuff. I think that'll be much better for fishing. I never knew marine paint was SO expensive either!

Anyways, i'm rambling now, my main question right now is should i be really concerned about all the ants and should i cut the deck open?

 

[gw204]

I've got bad news for you my friend. That boat is going to be a money pit.

Check this out...

http://www.extension.umn.edu/distributi ... K1015.html

It says carpenter ants remove wood as they make their tunnels.

You need to cut it open to see how bad the damage is. Don't throw any more money at that boat until you determine if you want to invest the time and cash in to fixing it right.

 

[plymouthgrady]

boat

take it off the trailer, wax & buff. It will make an impressive flower bed.
You'll be tacking a couple zero's on to the end of your budget.

 

[BobP]

Brian knows, listen to him.

 

[love2fish]

you make a good point Brian. Thats the point some other people are making to me as well. however, I'm thinking, if it floats, why mess with it? I really just want to go fishing and not have to pay $100 to be rubbing elbows with strangers every time i go.

Plymouth: i'm curious what i'm going to spend $100,000 on? My budget is not something like $50 but its not $5,000 either. For that i can probably just get a new used boat.

What will i need to repair the deck? possibly wood (if its being eaten) pressure treated 2x4s and marine plywood? and fiberglass supplies?

will this stuff do it right?

http://www.uscomposites.com/epoxy.html

i think i could get it done with 2 gallons some fiberglass cloth or tape and this,

http://www.fiberglasswarehouse.com/chop ... nd_mat.asp

That chopped strand mat looks just like what the deck is made of right now.

After replacing that and sealing the edges with fiberglass, I'll give it a coating of this,

http://shop.nonskidpaint.com/category.sc?categoryId=2

Or something similar.

I think I can get the deck re-done for about 800-1000. It will take ALOT of time though. I think i'm going to save that project for next year. Once we get the steering to work, we'll take it down to the water and mark it at the waterline then float around for an hour or two and check to make sure its not taking on water.

 

[Michigan Brian]

I would worry more about the stringers and transom on it than the deck. You never know what those carpenter ants got into

 

[CJBROWN]

Go for it!!

First, welcome to the Grady owners forum!!

Well, being an old wooden boat fanatic from years ago, I would be inclined to tinker with it some more before I made a flower bed out of it.

The ants may not have gotten into the bildge, maybe they did. I would get the cut-out diameter of a common inspection cover ring and cut a couple of holes in that deck so you can look in. Obviously you would want to try to do this between beams, but not the end of the world if you're over one, just don't cut through the beam. If its bad you can decide if you're going to replace the deck and beams, or just install the inspection plates and button 'er back up. At least you can get a good look under there.

A friend of mine had a soft deck in an older fiberglass boat that had rotten deck beams. They cut the deck out and replaced all the beams, repaired some stringers, and had a new deck built up by a pro. They wanted me to do the work but the poor guy is about 40 miles away from me in LA and I didn't want to make a zillion trips and work my a$$ off to do it. But I understand it turned out real nice and works like a champ.

I did a cockpit deck in a 60's vintage Fairliner, they are a plywood built boat. A couple of cracked deck beams were sistered, some decking replaced, and then a nice mahogany top decking was installed with rabbeted seams filled with deck caulk. It was beautiful and strong, and really improved the boat.

If you do remove the deck you can pull the tank and inspect/replace too. It's probably an old aluminum tank and may be corroded through, or about to.

If you're doing the work yourself it may not be too costly. Materials are expensive, and you want to use premium and marine grade stuff, but what really costs in boat restoration is yard labor. If you don't have that all kinds of complicated projects can be tackled without excessive cost.

My ex-wife's brother bought a Baltic Ketch in Seattle in the '80's when I still lived up there. It was 65' OA, 27' beam, 65 tons with no ballast, built in Denmark in 1897. What a relic. It had a 6-71 Jimmy diesel for auxilliary power, turned a 36" bronze 3-blade. We did a lot of work on that boat, planking, decks, sails, it was like working on a ship. Lots of volunteer labor. He was not a rich guy, a machinist by trade. Lost his wife over it, she couldn't handle living on it, but he owned the boat for many years. It ended up in Grays Harbor on the WA coast, where he became the captain of the Lady Washington for a couple of years, and then and is still the port commissioner. He finally sold the old girl, it looked like a pirate ship, to a guy that was going to bring down to CA. He told him not to do it durning winter as the Pacific is too rough, but the guy went anyway. He got into a big storm and had to be rescued by the CG. The boat went down in the Pacific Ocean somewhere.

So in looking at a project like that, if your hull is sound then the interior is quite possibly restorable, and although it could amount to considerable work, all you'll have invested is your time and some materials.

Let us know how it goes!

 

[plymouthgrady]

FIXER

Believe me, I would love nothing more than to see you get that puppy splashed! But I believe you're looking at a Pandora's Box. Michigan Brian makes the point. From the way you describe the boat, it needs more then a little TLC. I wouldn't go w/ the "if it floats, why mess w/ it"? b/c it may become a safety issue.
The "tack on a couple of zero's" is a figure of speech. Have you priced out marine products lately?

 

[Michigan Brian]

the other thing I saw no mention of, is are you sure all the ants are dead? Those things are nasty. You may need to get an exterminator to deal with them...

one more thing...

make sure you change the lower unit oil and your water pump impeller if it has not been done recently

 

[BobP]

The $100 bucks to rub elbows on the head boats is the best deal going, wait, you will see!

 

[love2fish]

I would worry more about the stringers and transom on it than the deck. You never know what those carpenter ants got into

The transom seems good. No cracks or warping that i can see and the old engine that was mounted on it was supported so that it did not have to support all that weight for so many years. What are stringers? :?

If you do remove the deck you can pull the tank and inspect/replace too. It's probably an old aluminum tank and may be corroded through, or about to.

I would get the cut-out diameter of a common inspection cover ring and cut a couple of holes in that deck so you can look in. Obviously you would want to try to do this between beams, but not the end of the world if you're over one, just don't cut through the beam. If its bad you can decide if you're going to replace the deck and beams, or just install the inspection plates and button 'er back up. At least you can get a good look under there.


So in looking at a project like that, if your hull is sound then the interior is quite possibly restorable, and although it could amount to considerable work, all you'll have invested is your time and some materials.

Thats what i'm hopeing! I should take some pictures for you guys so that you can see what i'm dealing with. when you say 'tank' you mean the fuel tank right? The one it has is plastic and is installed above the deck. I removed it and dumped it, washed it out with new gas and dumped that. THe guys at the gas station were not too thrilled with me but *shrug* tough! haha! I like your idea of cutting smaller holes to inspect before cutting the entire deck out and replaceing it. That seems like a good idea.

Believe me, I would love nothing more than to see you get that puppy splashed! But I believe you're looking at a Pandora's Box. Michigan Brian makes the point. From the way you describe the boat, it needs more then a little TLC. I wouldn't go w/ the "if it floats, why mess w/ it"? b/c it may become a safety issue.
The "tack on a couple of zero's" is a figure of speech. Have you priced out marine products lately?

Thanks for your concerns. I never think about safety!!! I was just going to stay near the dock for a while just to see the way it floated. I know this is a pandoras box type situation which is why i'm taking it slow. I've inspected the entire outside of the hull and came up with nothing other than its going to eventually need a coat of that paint thats $200 a gallon. Not too thrilled about that...

 

[gw204]

For comparisons sake, I paid $1500 for a '81 Mako 17 complete with '82 Merc 115, galvanized trailer, new fuel tank and lines (to be installed), new steering (to be installed), etc. Aside from a bad transom and gas tank hatch to be recored, the boat is in phenomenal condition. Gelcoat shines nicely, floor is solid, stringers seem solid, it just needs to be put back together.

I am sure I will have no less than $5000 (some probably not necessary, but I am a perfectionist) in this boat even with the old power.

I think your expectation of getting that boat on the water safely are unrealistic. In perfect conditions you might be OK, but it's that first time you take another boats wake wrong or get caught in a storm that you'll be in trouble.

Take the time and ensure the boat is solid and seaworthy before you get the bottom wet.

 

[gw204]

$200.... Not too thrilled about that...

That is a drop in the bucket for an old boat. It cost me that much just to get my engine up right and on to a stand because I didn't have a transom to hang it one and I didn't want it laying on it's side.

 

[drewmorton]

I agree with Brian. I am currently restoring an old Grady that I paid a grand for. I am hoping to finish it up for less than 10 grand in supplies and parts. I am doing all the labor. I thought the boat was in OK shape when I bought, a soft spot here, a little flex in the transom...no problem. Then I started taking the boat apart. Wet foam, rotten stringers, you name it. As I value my life and those of my family and others around me, I owe it to everyone to make sure the boat is sea-worthy and safe. You do too. Just do some really easy stuff, like inspect the fuel tank. Or, cut a hole in the deck and check out the plywood and foam underneath. Lift up on the end of the skeg and check for flex in the transom. I have a feeling youll find some ugly stuff. But, if you take your time, you can have a nice boat in the end. Theres lots of information available on the internet. Do some research. Good luck to you.

Drew

 

[love2fish]

Take the time and ensure the boat is solid and seaworthy before you get the bottom wet.

$200.... Not too thrilled about that...

That is a drop in the bucket for an old boat. It cost me that much just to get my engine up right and on to a stand because I didn't have a transom to hang it one and I didn't want it laying on it's side.

You're right, theres no point in rushing especially when theres peoples saftey involved. As for the paint comment, i was just trying illustrate to plymoth that i realize the costs that are involved in restoring a boat. Anyways, thats quite a project you've got there! I'm hopeing i wont have to get into all of that but probably will. These boats are a real can of worms eh?

I agree with Brian. I am currently restoring an old Grady that I paid a grand for. I am hoping to finish it up for less than 10 grand in supplies and parts. I am doing all the labor. I thought the boat was in OK shape when I bought, a soft spot here, a little flex in the transom...no problem. Then I started taking the boat apart. Wet foam, rotten stringers, you name it. As I value my life and those of my family and others around me, I owe it to everyone to make sure the boat is sea-worthy and safe. You do too. Just do some really easy stuff, like inspect the fuel tank. Or, cut a hole in the deck and check out the plywood and foam underneath. Lift up on the end of the skeg and check for flex in the transom. I have a feeling youll find some ugly stuff. But, if you take your time, you can have a nice boat in the end. Theres lots of information available on the internet. Do some research. Good luck to you.

Drew

10 grand? sh!!t! I'll be checking out the boats interior this weekend. will post some pictures. hopefully i wont have to get into all of that. whats the skeg? I need to learn all this boat terminology. Is there a good place i can go to learn this stuff? Maybe a book i can get? I wanted to get a book on boat construction but the store didnt have anyting. All i've got so far is a seloc book on my motor.

Thanks again for everyones input as it is much appreciated!

 

[gw204]

Is there a good place i can go to learn this stuff?

www.classicmako.com

More knowledge there than you'll get out of any book.

 

[CJBROWN]

Is there a good place i can go to learn this stuff?

www.classicmako.com

More knowledge there than you'll get out of any book.

That's a great site Brian. I went thru a few of the projects, and I swear these are more work than the old wooden boats. At least you could see what you were dealing with when they are all wood. Seems wooden cores on fiberglass boats are a giant PITA.

Thank you for the link, it's entertaining at least, even makes me want to do a project.....maybe...one day... 8)

Makes me appreciate my 'new' boat, it doesn't have any issues.

I have a giant box of hand-woodworking tools I keep threatening to sell off on e-bay. Wifey keeps telling me I should hang on them and pass that knowledge on to my son. We should build another boat, maybe a strip-built canoe or kayak or something.