winterizing/tuneup prices, services, etc.- lots of questions

[boslaw]

I'm motor mechanically challenged, and I'm new to boating (so maybe I'm doubly challenged). I'm learning lots as I go, but for my first year, I plan to outsource winterizing and tune up.

A local grady dealer offers a price of $410 (labor & parts) to winterize and tune up my 1997 Yamaha 200hp v6. Their service includes: Change lower unit lube, replace fuel filter, grease all fittings and pivot point, spray block with corrosion preventative fog and drain block, stabilize fuel, change oil and filter.

Tune Includes: Pressure and vacuum test lower unit, compression test, spark plugs, set timing, adjust carbs, check cooling and changing, synchronize throttle

Does this price seem reasonable (I'm in Massachusetts). Is there any other recommended service I should have done to the boat or motor?

I just had a bottom paint done in May and condition seems great (even though I keep it in a saltwater slip) so I'll probably skip that or just touch up where needed.

I'll probably pull the battery and keep it on a trickle charger at home all winter.

Shrinkwrapping looks to be about $400-500. Would it be better to buy a custom cover for that same price? I'm a little worried about a cover because I live in the woods with a lot of pine trees and I'll probably get sap on the cover. On the flip side, it's only a cover and it will only be used in the winter. I assume there's a good reason why most people shrink wrap instead of cover but I just don't know why.

I don't plan to put the boat on jack stands - I'll keep it in my yard on my trailer, but I will try to jack the trailer a bit off the ground to save the tires.

They also offer to winterize my freshwater washdown and livewell for $40 each, but I assume all I need to do with those is add some antifreeze to the freshwater washdown and drain the livewell pump?

I plan to change the oil filter at the beginning of next season. Should I also do it when I winterize? Seems like that would be a waste.

Anything else I'm missing? My Yammy fuel guage is reading incorrect fuel level and I'll need that fixed too. I may try to just replace the guage myself, and if the guage is not the problem then I'll have them repair the float (or try to figure out how to do that myself).

Thanks, as usual, for all of the tips, advice, etc.

Andre

 

[Capt Bill]

I do my own winterizing, and always have, so I don't know if that price is "good" or not, but seems reasonable. If you get a custom winter cover, spend the extra to get a lighter weight Sunbrella. I had a Fisher Canvas cover for my previous Sailfish, and the thing was so heavy, I only used it twice in 10 years. Went back to shrink wrapping after the first 2 seasons. If yo have lots of help to put a cover on, you might not care about the weight.

I don't worry about jacking up the trailer to "save the tires'. In the 13 or 14 years that I had the previous trailer, I never did that, and the tires lasted fine. I never trailer at highway speeds; only use the trailer for launch, haulout and winter storage. You should cover the tires though, to prevent UV exposure, which will damage the tires and shorten their useful life.

I think you are on the right track. If yo have specific questions on doing your own winterizing, there is plenty of help available for the asking, here on this board.

 

[ocnslr]

We don't winterize. We just fish year-round....

 

[Capt Bill]

We don't winterize. We just fish year-round....

Go ahead, rub it in. :twisted: !!! jk :lol:

When and how often do you haul out for bottom cleaning/painting? Do you haul out if there is winter freeze; colder than normal winter? Hafd to imagine that your winters are *that* much milder than I.R. or o.c.

 

[plymouthgrady]

One thing I do not recommend is trickle charging your battery. At the end of the season, put a full charge on them. If you want, mid-winter charge them up again and then before you splash spike them up again. Trickle chargers, especially all winter long, are bad for batteries.
That price seems a little high. While it sounds like they are doing alot, they are all pretty much 5 minute jobs. Change filter-done. Grease fittings-done. Spray block-done. Dump stabilizer in-done, etc. ('cause there are more)!
ALL JOBS YOU CAN DO!
There are some jobs they will do that you may not be comfortable doing, but they make your "winter decomissioning" soung alot more glamorous and involved than it really is.
I may be missing something but set timing (belt) and check /change cooling? On a 2 stroke?
Too much for shrink wrapping-shop around. Guys will come to your house and do it in your driveway. Don't buy into the all-in-one package.
It may sound frugal but don't cut your shrink wrap off in the spring, pull it off and store the frame. I'm on my 2nd year-decrease wrap bill and increase fuel budget!!!

 

[boslaw]

thanks for the tips. Didn't know that about the batteries. I don't know how old mine are because I bought used this year, but they've been fine (full charge all summer). Didn't really know what to do for the winter.

I can certainly change the oil filter, dump stabilizer in, etc. I was mostly worried about flushing fluids, doing more in depth stuff to the motor. (as I said, I'm really not familiar with motors and with my luck I'd do something incorrectly and screw my motor up. A few hundred bucks almost seems worthwhile for piece of mind (maybe).

Wouldn't it be easier to buy a custom cover for your boat instead of saving shrinkwrap year to year? Also, where do you store all that plastic in the summer?

 

[plymouthgrady]

I roll it up and stick it under the porch. I live in a wooded secluded area so I take some liberties by just leaving the frame "out". A custom cover is good for keeping debris out but can't sustain the weight of snow/collected rain.
Outboards by design are self-draining (all the anti-freeze they run through will drain out) but it will force any water out.
I suggest having someone doing it for you the first time in increase your comfort level but watch what they do. Winterizing an outboard is simple.

 

[CJBROWN]

Uh, change oil and filter on a 2-stroke? Hmmm. I would pay them to sync carbs, pull the lower unit and replace the pump impellor, but do the rest myself.
There are no 'timing belts' or oil filters on a 2-stroke. Maybe they're talking about the oil tank and filter.

There's nothing wrong with trickle charging a battery at 1 or 2 amps, like with a 'battery-tender' or similar device. If you have lead-acid batteries and they're bubbling a lot then pull off the charger for a week. Letting them sit in the boat and slowly discharge is certainly not any better.

We don't winterize out here so no experience with shrink-wrapping. But covers are popular, don't have to be real expensive, and work great. I bought one of the Taylor-Made semi-custom covers for about $275 and I'll be on season three with it with zero problems. The boat comes out looking like the day we put it away.

A lot of guys don't mind paying high labor rates for work a shop or marine service will do. I have always done my own and got the manuals or help if I didn't understand something. But I know it's done, and I know it's done right, and it familiarizes one with the inner workings and how everything goes together which makes it that much easier for troubleshooting and future maintenance.

Changing plugs and lower unit grease is pretty darn easy if a guy is handy at all. Some of the complicated stuff like syncing carbs and stuff in some cases requires specialized equipment, so it makes sense to pay someone to do that work. JMHO.

 

[plymouthgrady]

Yeah, CJ- got some 4 stroke work on a 2 stroke engine. Sounds like he just went down a check list. Gotta make sure I change my coolant! (???)
Sorry I didn't mention it but bring the batteries in for the winter!
You can also do the blue tarp for covering but can be a PITA.

 

[Grog]

I also do it myself but $400 seems a little high for maybe 1.5 hours of work. The parts don't add up to much on a 2 stroke.

Don't just drain the livewell, disconnect the pick-up hose and put it in the gallon jug of antifreeze and run the pump until the water is gone. Leave all seacocks open.

Pull the batteries, check their water level (fill with distilled water) and trickle charge until full then hit once a month.

The oil filter is a little in-line filter under the oil tank, change it whenever you want, just change it.

Fuel guages are a joke, it's rare that they're accurate. For the price you'll pay to have them look at it and maybe fix it you can put a fuel flow monitir system in. You will know the gas used, current usage rate and MPG. If you're not familar don't mess around with gas tanks, it's not worth it.

For the cover, the blue tarps are a major pain. They work for a while then they start to fall apart or blow off. My guy charges $11/ft to wrap. If you're discreet, sometimes the workers will shrink wrap on the side. Since you store the boat at your house the yard will not know who wraps it. $500 is steep for a boat to be wrapped.

 

[boslaw]

thanks. You guys are all convincing me that I should do most of this myself. I have the wrap around connector for flushing with fresh water hose (should I have been doing this after every trip? Heard mixed messages about it but I never see anyone doing it at my slip so I think I'm pretty safe on this one). I guess I'll give it a try. I have my manual so I assume it's all explained well enough in there.

Would any of you have a tune-up done by a shop (on an old motor like this) or does that also seem like a waste of money? I guess my concern is, I don't know how well this has been maintained in the past. I assume it's ok since it's worked perfectly all season, but I don't know what to check for leaks, fittings, etc.

 

[Banana River View]

Boslaw.. In your first post you said you were motor mechanically challenged so my first question is do you have the tools to do the job you want?

It sounds like you need to find a good mechanic to have him look over your engine and to look for the small things that may lead to large things. One thing you have did not mention is changing and inspection of your impeller and impeller housing. Do you know when that was last done? Again, not that hard to do yourself if you have the tools and the bolts are not frozen in place.

I have a saying that is true, at least for me, most of the time. "It only costs you a little more to do it yourself."

Good luck with your decision but if it were me I would get a professional to look over my engine. Make sure they are certified by Yamaha. Certification and yearly training are one of the reasons for the costs. ..BRV

 

[boslaw]

thanks. I have the tools, and I'm construction mechanically challenged, but when it comes to motor mechanics, I don't have a clue. If I see someone do something, or at least understand what the parts are for, I can usually figure it out. Where I get in trouble is when I <think> I know what I'm doing but I really don't. . .

I have all of the tools, so things like changing the oil filter and actually changing the oil are not a problem. Where I'm struggling is things like:

1. fogging the motor. Don't really know what that means. I've read some, and I'm sure there are instructions somewhere on the web (spraying fogging oil in the spark plugs, etc.) but beyond that I'd be uncertain.

2. As you said, looking for small things that may lead to large things. I wouldn't even know where to begin. Last week, the zinc fell off the bottom of my motor. I wouldn't have even thought about it - I had pulled the boat into a cove for swimming, and raised the motor so it wouldn't get stuck in the sand. My father noticed that a part was missing - I wouldn't have. Luckily, I knew what the part was and what it was for, so it was an easy fix for me, but who knows what I'll miss?

3. changing the impeller - don't know if/when it was last done. Don't know how to check. Again, I could probably figure it out if I researched online or read my manual, but it's just another thing that I wouldn't have considered if you didn't mention it on the forum.

I'm sure that if I do the basics referred to on this thread, I'll probably be fine but I'll probably not feel 100% comfortable. My ultimate decision probably won't be made until November when I pull it out of the water, but I'm trying to find out what everyone else does, what's easy, what I need to think about, etc. I'm a little anal about all these things I guess.

 

[seasick]

By researching the internet and asking questions, you are on the right track. Most winterizing tasks are relatively easy and if you have someone with experience to guide you the first time, all the better.

I flush the motor with muffs and a Salt Away kit prior to fogging and with the motor running. By the way, I flush my motor with fresh water after every outing(with the motor off)

Remove the prop. Note the order of the spacers and washers.

Drain the lower unit:Inspect the oil.

Do you need to pressure / vacuum test the lower unit every season? For me, if there is nothing wrapped aroung the shaft AND the lower oil looks good (not cloudy), most likely the seals are OK; no need to test.

Fill the lower unit with the correct oil. Always replace the washers for the oil plugs. I put a little antisieze compound on the oil plug threads. Buy a hand pump that attaches to the oil container to fill the unit.

Change the impeller? Again for me, if the pee hole stream is strong, I figure I will wait until I sense a change. Look I don't do ocean voyages and don't do overnighters. I am always within BoatUS towing zones.
( lots of boaters will argue over this point)

I change the fuel filter every season AFTER the first start up of the new season. That way if there is junk in the lines or tank, hopefully It will clog the old filter. I always take a look of what is in the old filter to check for evidence of possible problems. You need to let the fluids sit for a while to see if there are contaminants like water. I change the spark plugs (also after initial startup while fogging oils burn off). Learn how to 'read' your old plugs for evidence of problems.

I add Stabil to my fuel prior to fogging and run the motor for a few minutes (with muffs) I want theStabil to run through the entire fuel system/ I make sure my tank is almost full.

There is a filter on the Yami engine under the cowling. At the end of each season AFTER winterizing and fogging, I remove it, inspect and clean it and leave it empty for the winter.


80% of the boaters at my club leave their batteries in their boats for the winter.
I may try that this year. In the past I have removed them and stored them in my garage and off of the concrete floor ( old wives tale?)
I charge each them once a month at most. Don't continuosly charge them.

Drain all lines of water and add biodegradable antifreeze (Marine store suff) as necessary. If you have a fresh water system, add enough antifreeze so that you can run the system until pink water comes out of the faucet.
My livewell is self draining, I don't add antifreeze but I do run the pump to make sure the lines are clear. Same for the salt water washdown.

Storage cover? This is a tough question. Wrap is expensive ( and not so eco friendly) but generally looks good and usually fits tightly. If the contours of the boat will result in depressions or flat spots the wrap will get torn by snow (actually it's the snow that melts and then freezes and the resultant ice) or by puddles of water. These puddles get amazingly heavy in a short amount of time
Even custom covers can easilly be damaged if you are not there for every storm to clear it of ice and show.

For the first year, try a decent tarp, one that doesn't cost an arm and a leg and one that you won't cry over when it rips.
If you are going to wrap, make sure you have fire insurance. I am not kidding.

If you use blocks or boat stands for storage, DO NOT LASH THE TARP TO THE STANDS OR BLOCKS.

There is probably more but my mind is getting fuzzy.
Good luck with your boat.

 

[CJBROWN]

Water pump impellor replacement

There's an excellent tutorial on changing the pump impellor in Yamaha outboards over on THT. Just in case you want to do it yourself. It's a 'sticky' here in the Shipyard Is. Marine section: http://www.thehulltruth.com/forums/foru ... asp?fid=14

The tutorial is on a F200 but there are updates and comments to cover several other motors. I don't recal if there was something specific for the OX66. In fact, you might get quite a bit of 'how-to' on DIY engine maintenance over there.

Seems to me the manual has the impellor on a maintenance list annully, but I would think every three or four should be sufficient unless you're picking up mud, silt, or sand. I wouldn't wait 'till it fails, but I also wouldn't go to the trouble to replace it every year. Maybe I'll change my mind on that when I do mine the first time and see what it looks like.

 

[boslaw]

thanks for the link. They have a bunch of excellent tutorials (with pictures!) for all kinds of Yamaha maintenance. Definitely gives me confidence I can do most of this myself.