Anchor Swivel issues

[ROBERTH]

Ok, so first year using the new Windlass and Lewmar Delta anchor. Moved from 13# to 22# model since my 13# just did not want to self lauch, so figured I needed more weight.
However, the 22# will not self launch either. It does go out better, but still have to pull out a foot or so and drive around until I am ready to drop it. Guess that might be due to the design of the pulpit roller, dunno.....anyone else have that problem?

Next issue is it seems that when retrieving the anchor, the SS swivel gets jacked up on the anchor and stuck. I have to reach over and try to shake it to unjamb it, but hard to reach, especially this weekend in 5' seas. So kept redropping it and finally it pulled straight for me. The swivel was made for 1/4-5/16" chain. I have the 1/4" high test. Anyone else have this issue?

And finally, guess this is something you all have happen is when pulling the anchor back up, if I hesitate from the time it leaves the water to the time the anchor shaft starts to come up on the roller, the anchor spins around facing outward. Again, have to lay down and try to spin it, but by the time I get back up, it spins back outward again! :huh Now I sit up front with remote and keep it coming until I just get to the roller and try to time the stop just right. Sure wish that remote was instantaneous like the helm switch. You have to guestimate when to stop or it will send the anchor to the sky....yikes!

Overall, it has been great. Just wondering if these spoofs are normal or if I have something mismatched here.

 

[NOTHING ELSE MATTERS]

Need picture of your pulpit.
The S/S swivel is most likely put on reversed, or is too small. I have one of those on all my boats and never had a problem.
The Delta anchor, when you bring it up, as soon as the stem of the anchor touches the pulpit roller stop, the anchor will turn facing down (gravity), then continue to bring up snug on the roller.

 

[DennisG01]

Agree with all of the above. It should just work - even with the 13lb. Not sure why it's getting hung up - a picture would be good. When you're pulling it back in and it gets to the forward roller, just keep going. It'll go "bang, bang, flop, flop" but it will come in correctly.

What do you mean when you say that you release the button but the windlass doesn't stop? It should stop right away regardless of whether you're using the helm or bow controls.

 

[ROBERTH]

I don't have the bow controls. I opted for the wireless remote instead. It has a momentary delay. Likely due to transmit time and reciept of the command. Lewmar mentions it in their manual for the remote.

I only have one roller. If I try to continue to bring it up, it comes up, upside down.

Here is a pic of the swivel connection and roller.

Also, mostly when I first pull on the chain to help it for the first foot, it does not in any way feel like it is held back or has any resistance other than the weight of the chain.

 

[DennisG01]

Delay... OK, I see. I just put a Lewmar into my Sundancer, but I did the bow foot switches. It's hard to tell from the picture, but it appears you have the same swivel as me - is it sort of a squared-off bullet shape at each end, with the middle being wider? I think mine was rated for either 1/4" or 5/16", as well. I'm also using 1/4" HT chain.

Also, mostly when I first pull on the chain to help it for the first foot, it does not in any way feel like it is held back or has any resistance other than the weight of the chain.

Not sure I understand what you mean. But... If you relax the chain, does the anchor feel like it's wedged into the roller, or does it feel more like it's "balanced" in the roller? In other words, if you gave the shank end a slight upward push, would the anchor then fall out of the roller?

I still don't get why it doesn't "right" itself as it comes further and further over the roller. Even with my "two roller" anchor roller, the anchor is still only hitting the first roller until after it rights itself and gets pulled in further. Have you tried letting the windlass pulling it further in or have you always stopped a bit short?

 

[ocnslr]

I would hazard a guess that your Delta anchors - 13# or 22# - didn't drop easily because they are sort of jammed on the end of the pulpit. You are using the original anchor roller, designed for a small Danforth type anchor.

We have a 22# Delta and when I set it all up many years ago I went with a larger anchor roller, designed for that style anchor. It not only drops, but it never fails to turn into the correct position as soon as the anchor gets started into the roller.

Here are some photos:

 

[DennisG01]

Funny... I woke up this morning thinking about your roller! So what I was thinking was along the same lines as mentioned above. First, does the roller spin freely, or is it maybe tightened too tight? Second, is the center "channel" of the roller "gripping" the shank too tightly? Meaning, is the shank wedging itself into the channel? You don't need a totally flat roller, but obviously one that allows the shank to slide/twist into the right position.

An inexpensive fix might be a trailer "keel" roller (would 3" work?) - look for the kind that is shaped like a flattened V. It's a V-shape where the point of the V is flattened out. That's not the best description.... If it doesn't make sense, let me know and I'll get a picture.

 

[DennisG01]

Here's a picture of my recent install on the Sundancer - I don't think you can make out the rollers, but maybe you at least make out the swivel and compare it to yours. If you can make out the rollers, look at the second one (aft).

 

[DennisG01]

Here, got a picture of my front roller. This is one of the original rollers that came with the anchor roller setup from Windline (original to the boat in 1999). This one was originally the aft roller. When the original forward roller started cracking I moved the aft one forward and replaced the bad one with the trailer roller (about $5 compared to $40).

 

[ROBERTH]

Ok, so when I first did this upgrade, I figured the old roller was in need of replacement after 20 years. I liked the hard why nylon type that Lewmar made, so installed one of those. After a few uses, it was showing signs of gouging and did not really gain much from the original roller I had. So I got a new one from windline to match the original. It is very nice actually and fit better. My assembly is very narrow. The wheel is on 2.5" wide. It is rounded quite a bit so should allow room for the anchor to turn I think. Posting a pic of it here.

 

[ROBERTH]

Oh yeah, Dennis, thanks for the dedication, but get some sleep! :-|

The roller is loose and spins very well. I actually did add some grease to it to make sure. Also, I did not tighten the nylon lock nuts too much to keep it from binding. I think I am good there.

I did have to make my own bail when I went from the 13# to the 22# as the original bail did not allow the anchor to come back to correct resting position. I have to say the bail came out perfect and is highly polished. Proud of it! It holds the anchor down very well.

I did notice though, that in your pic, the bail is fixed. It does not allow movement forward or back. Not sure that really matters as the only issue I am having is that the anchor is not self launching or turning for me when coming up.

I think I might try to see if I can bring it up to the swivel and stop it and see if it will rotate in that position? Or is your just turning as you continue to retrieve it onto the roller?

I was wanting to put one of those lewmar double roller assemblies on in place of my original as it looked like it would work much better, especially with the self launch, but that would have required a lot of re-engineering the pulpit to fill in the groove that makes it flush. Some others convinced me I didn't need to do that as their anchors were working fine with the original design.

This is all a minor convenience, but just hoping I can compare notes with you all and see if there is some further tweeking I can do.
I found it very hard to find any rollers that were this narrow. Most were like 3" wide.

I apppreciate your information, keep it coming.

 

[ROBERTH]

Dennis, I just picked up something in your pic that is different that my setup. You have a shackle connecting from your anchor to your swivel. My Swivel is connected directly to the anchor. This would likely resolve my issue with the binding of the swivel on the anchor. Will see if I can dig out my old shackle and do this setup. I wonder if this will also allow the anchor to spin around better.....hmmmm.

 

[DennisG01]

Yes, my bail is fixed. Never gets in the way, though. Nice job on your homemade bail - I never would of guessed it wasn't factory!

I never have to touch my anchor. As the windlass pulls it in, it rights itself every time. Now, if for some reason the anchor is bouncing around a lot, I may let my finger (or foot, depending on where I am... helm or bow) off the switch for a second. But that's the extent of it - it always rights itself.

If I remember correctly, the reason I used a shackle was that the swivel's mouth either wasn't big enough, or long enough, to attach directly to the anchor shank. But, you bring up a good point - and one that is easily/cheaply tested. I can imagine that the swivel wouldn't work as well if there is a force acting against it's longitudinal axis since the two halves would sort of "jam" into/against each other. In other words, I don't know how well the swivel would function if it wasn't oriented in a "straight line pull", so to say. The shackle would lend some extra flexibility... and would certainly keep your swivel from getting jacked up like you mentioned.

I'm still confused about why it doesn't self launch, though.

 

[ROBERTH]

Yeah, me too on the self launch. For sure I was thinking that the 22# would do the trick. That is quite a bit of weight sticking out there! I can actually pull the chain out manually and let it lay on the pulpit just to see if that was the restriction, but the anchor just lays there. This is very weird to me. Almost as if the shank is heavy enough to be the counter balance.

 

[DennisG01]

Even the smaller anchor should have worked. How about the front-most part of the anchor roller - where the anchor contacts the stainless steel? Could the anchor be getting jammed in there? If you move the anchor out of the windlass about an inch, does it then fall? What about if you just give it a smack - sort of like to jostle it free?

 

[ROBERTH]

I usually have to loosen rode from the windless enough to allow the anchor to move forward and sit at about a 45 degree angle. It is likely several inches moved forward to achieve this before it would launch on it's own. That is the weird part to me in having to move it so far forward before it will want to take off.

Found a couple of other good pics to show more detail of the setup.

 

[DennisG01]

Hmmm... The bail looks awful close to the shank. Can you try it without the bail on there?

 

[DennisG01]

The only other thing I can think of - as I'm looking at my setup right now, is the shape of your roller pulpit. Mine has the second roller higher than the first. In essence, the second roller becomes the pivot point. But on yours, the pivot point is much further out. Try this - remove the anchor and hold it, with your hand, where the roller would normally contact it. If the anchor balances, or the shank falls down (think teeter tottor), you've found the problem... Need a new anchor roller.

 

[ROBERTH]

As you slightly move the anchor forward, it does not touch the bail. I thought the bail was to help hold the anchor down so it would not bounce up and down, but you make a good point.
I will fiddle with it some this weekend since I have to remove some of the cover to get to it and see how it moves forward in relation to the bail. I don't recall it raising up and hitting it. However, if it does, then that could be why it is holding it back as it can't lift up as it wants to slide foward. I would be very surprised if this is the problem, but I will definately give it a go.

 

[bayrat]

Ok, so first year using the new Windlass and Lewmar Delta anchor. Moved from 13# to 22# model since my 13# just did not want to self lauch, so figured I needed more weight.
However, the 22# will not self launch either. It does go out better, but still have to pull out a foot or so and drive around until I am ready to drop it. Guess that might be due to the design of the pulpit roller, dunno.....anyone else have that problem?

Next issue is it seems that when retrieving the anchor, the SS swivel gets jacked up on the anchor and stuck. I have to reach over and try to shake it to unjamb it, but hard to reach, especially this weekend in 5' seas. So kept redropping it and finally it pulled straight for me. The swivel was made for 1/4-5/16" chain. I have the 1/4" high test. Anyone else have this issue?

And finally, guess this is something you all have happen is when pulling the anchor back up, if I hesitate from the time it leaves the water to the time the anchor shaft starts to come up on the roller, the anchor spins around facing outward. Again, have to lay down and try to spin it, but by the time I get back up, it spins back outward again! :huh Now I sit up front with remote and keep it coming until I just get to the roller and try to time the stop just right. Sure wish that remote was instantaneous like the helm switch. You have to guestimate when to stop or it will send the anchor to the sky....yikes!

Overall, it has been great. Just wondering if these spoofs are normal or if I have something mismatched here.

I feel your pain. Have a Delta anchor that didn't launch most of the time. Figured it was because the anchor roller was like yours and designed for a Danforth. Bought one designed for a Delta and it didn't work any better and had NO bail. Same problems retrieving so I added the swivel. Had the same problems as you as far as it spinning around and ending up backwards.I think it might be possessed !! Thinking of going to a cinder block with a rope ! The manufacturer says they don't make a bail for it, but I need one for sure.