New Electronics in '97 Sailfish 272.

[Richard1572]

I'm headed to the Ft Lauderdale boat show later this week to do my final electronics shopping and plan to install new electronics in November. Right now, unless I see something very compelling at the boat show my plan is to install a Garmin GPSMap 1243XSV with the radar bundle and add the Garmin fuel flow sensors to eliminate my NAVMAN. I’m going to keep my Raymarine Autopilot (not pictured) as it works fine. As shown in the pictures below I plan to move my engine instruments to up where my current electronics are and move the position of the chart plotter to the left of the helm as a 12" unit won’t fit in the existing box above the helm and I’m concerned if you did modify the box and put it up there it would be too high and obstruct your view. I realize I need to do something about the compass and starboard switch panel but I don’t want to take on more than I can complete prior to our scheduled Christmas Florida Keys vacation. So that will most likely be a January project


My primary question is, has anyone else located their chart plotter to the left of the helm and if so, how has this worked out for you ergonomically? My concern is not having them directly in front or you might be a bit awkward to view and manipulate. The other option I was thinking about was putting 2 9” units in the existing location. The cost would be about the same maybe a little more and I would have some level of redundancy. Now that I’m typing this and looking at the pics I’m starting to lean more to the 2, 9” units. Thoughts and suggestions please.

 

[seasick]

If you use polarized sunglasses normally, bring them to the show and see if your proposed placement causes visibility issues. Some MFDs are more sensitive to angles especially with polarized sunglasses. That test should cover vertical position as well as left to right. I tend to stand when driving and stand more to the center of the helm rather than directly behind the wheel. My point is that an MFD a tad off center to the left works better than directly in line with the wheel.
It is also tricky to compare the two different placements if the actual displays would be different size screens. I can't tell from your rendition if the two displays are the same size as the single. In is clear that two displays are better than one, all else being equal especially when displaying mapping, sonar AND radar. Again, see how those configs look at the show.

 

[blindmullet]

UGH! Another draw back to older Grady ownership. You have a 27' boat and there isn't a lot of room for electronics like on a CC. If you took that entire area where you mocked the 9" could you go larger? There seems to be a lot of wasted space on the sides. Add a piece of material that covers the entire area. If not, I like the twin 9" screens so you can run bottom and charts all the time. I ended up doing a 9" and not 2 7's because I could never read my Zuke gauge when it was down in the old gauge area. I'm building a storage insert for the old gauge area. Probably a large Yeti cup holder to the right and a electronics charging area below the GPS.

 

[Hookup1]

if you have newer engines you can use the NMEA 2000 interface to get engine information to display on the Garmin unit. You probably need a cable installed in each engine. Engines have fuel flow meters built-in. Plus you get oil pressure, coolant temp and fuel burn calculations.

My preference is two screens. It's really nice to be able to set one screen on the sounder and the other for navigation/radar and popup full screen when you need it. I would try to squeeze two 12" displays in side-by-side. Or one 12" up top with engine gauges to the side and another 12" below. The 943xsv is a good unit but the 1243xsv has more screen resolution.

I have my 943xsv up top in the electronics box and my 4210 at the helm. The 4210 will likely be replaced soon with a 8612xsv (more screen resolution than 1243xsv). I was wating to see if Garmin announced any new chart plotters at the show.

 

[Richard1572]

Thanks for all the feedback. I hadn’t thought about the angled viewing being an issue so I'll definitely check out the screens with my Costas. I do spend 90% of my time at the helm and very rarely stand amidships to steer as I can’t reach the throttles from amidships and I find the helm seat comfortable. I also hadn’t noticed the resolution difference between the 12” (1280 x 800) vs the 9” (1280 x 720) so I’ll check that out too.

Unfortunately, my engines don’t support NMEA 2000 output and new engines are not in the budget, especially now. They are Hondas with only 900 hours and run like a top (knock on wood). Honda didn’t start supporting NMEA output until 2010. I like my Honda’s not just because they run well but they are so much easier to work on than Yamaha or Merc and I’m definitely a DIYer. Also, there is an excellent aftermarket parts market for just about any major engine component. Only downside is there is not as many YouTube instructional videos as for Yamaha or Merc but the factory service manual is very detailed with step-by-step instructions for just about everything. I have been eying a converter that takes analog engine gauge outputs and converts them to NMEA 2000 which could be a future project. It’s probably a little fiddly to get calibrated initially but a lot cheaper than new engines.

I placed a cutout of the 12” screen up above the dash and it sticks up about 2 inches and I’m not a fan. The sides aren’t the issue it’s the height. Maybe I could mess with them to sit a little lower and will play around with that a bit more. As far as the overhead box, I was actually thinking of moving my VHF down to the dash too, out of that box, essentially getting everything out of that box and making it solely a glove box or some kind of storage. There is little no storage outside of the cuddy in this boat. I modified the side glove boxes some to increase their capacity but still there is next to no storage for tackle and such. I was thinking of using the overhead box for tackle trays or something.

Lastly, one of the reasons I was waiting for the show was to see if Garmin or anyone else is introducing anything that is worth waiting for and, probably wishful thinking, to see if they had any smokin’ show deals. The best pricing, I have seen at retail shops or online has been from a guy on The Hull truth called SemperFishing. His reviews on The Hull Truth seem pretty good. Anyone here purchase from him?

 

[Hookup1]

SemperFishing on THT is a great resource. Garmin price fixes all the dealers so you won't see any deals on newer equipment. Only angle I found was West Marine. They give you 4% points if you are in their club and on certain Holidays throughout the year they offer triple points 12%.

I had to cut the fiberglass on the helm box to get the 4210 in. It's worth the effort to get the 1243 in there. So much easier to view. On my boat I can get the 1243 or 8612 in there.



943xsv $1,399.99
physical 9.2" x 6.4" x 3" (23.3 x 16.2 x 7.6 cm). 5 1/2" cutout height
screen 7.8" x 4.4"; 9.0" diagonal
WXGA; 1280 x 720

8610xsv $2,699.99.
physical 10.25" x 8.0625" x 2.95" (25.9 cm x 20.5 cm x 7.5 cm). 6 15/16" cutout height
screen 8.6" x 5.4"; 10.1" diagonal
WUXGA; 1920 x 1200 pixels. <<< Best resolution

1243xsv is $2,899.99
physical 12.1” x 8.9” x 3.2” (30.8 x 22.8 x 8.2 cm). 7 15/16" cutout height
screen. 10.3" x 6.4"; 12.1" diagonal
WXGA; 1280 x 800 pixels

8612xsv $3,999.99
physical 11.9" x 8.5" x 3" (30.3 cm x 21.6 cm x 7.6 cm) 7 3/8" cutout height
10.1" x 5.7"; 11.6" diagonal
FHD; 1920 x 1080 pixels

8616xsv $5,999.00
physical 15.1" x 10.3" x 3" (38.5 cm x 26.3 cm x 7.6 cm) 9 3/16" cutout height
screen 13.6" x 7.7"; 15.6" diagonal
FHD; 1920 x 1080 pixels

8617 $7,499.00
physical 16.5" x 12.1" x 2.8" (41.9 cm x 30.7 cm x 7.1 cm) 9 3/16" cutout height
screen 14.4" x 9.1"; 17.0" diagonal
WUXGA; 1920 x 1200 pixels

4210
physical 13.4" x 8.9" x 4.2" (34 x 22.6 x 10.7 cm) 8 5/16" cutout height
screen 8.3" x 6.3"; 10.4" diagonal
SVGA; 800 x 600 pixels

 

[Richard1572]

Yea I made myself a little cardboard cutout and the 1243 looks like it will fit with the cutout you made above. I also made a cardboard cutout of the 943 and side beside the size difference is dramatic. One of my concerns was the clearance on the top. I looks like you were able to just squeeze the deeper part of the unit under the top and not have to actually cut the top of the dashboard? I’m going to look around and see if I can find the dimension of the deeper part of the unit not just the overall dimensions. Maybe an online install manual will have that.

 

[Mustang65fbk]

SemperFishing on THT is a great resource. Garmin price fixes all the dealers so you won't see any deals on newer equipment. Only angle I found was West Marine. They give you 4% points if you are in their club and on certain Holidays throughout the year they offer triple points 12%.

I had to cut the fiberglass on the helm box to get the 4210 in. It's worth the effort to get the 1243 in there. So much easier to view. On my boat I can get the 1243 or 8612 in there.

View attachment 23492

943xsv $1,399.99
physical 9.2" x 6.4" x 3" (23.3 x 16.2 x 7.6 cm)
screen 7.8" x 4.4"; 9.0" diagonal
WXGA; 1280 x 720

8610xsv $2,699.99.
physical 10.25" x 8.0625" x 2.95" (25.9 cm x 20.5 cm x 7.5 cm)
screen 8.6" x 5.4"; 10.1" diagonal
WUXGA; 1920 x 1200 pixels. <<< Best resolution

1243xsv is $2,899.99
physical 12.1” x 8.9” x 3.2” (30.8 x 22.8 x 8.2 cm)
screen. 10.3" x 6.4"; 12.1" diagonal
WXGA; 1280 x 800 pixels

8612xsc $3,999.99
physical 11.9" x 8.5" x 3" (30.3 cm x 21.6 cm x 7.6 cm)
10.1" x 5.7"; 11.6" diagonal
FHD; 1920 x 1080 pixels

4210
physical 13.4" x 8.9" x 4.2" (34 x 22.6 x 10.7 cm)
screen 8.3" x 6.3"; 10.4" diagonal
SVGA; 800 x 600 pixels

How do you like the 943xsv that you have? I think when I go to replace my electronics that it will be my first choice, if something new hasn't come out in the mean time and replaced it already. I agree on the pricing with Garmin... it seems like the only deal you might be able to get was if you shopped online, or in a state, and bought through a website/store that doesn't charge you sales tax. I don't know about out there, but here in Washington state sales tax is now over 10%... which can definitely make a difference on a several thousand dollar purchase. My question... has anyone run a unit(s) up near the helm for navigation/sonar and then run an iPad near the rear of the boat for fishing or other? I think I'll probably just buy the mapping charts chip for the current Garmin 7" model that I have now because I just bought the boat, and then maybe later on down the line upgrade to the 943xsv in the dash flip up area on my 228 Seafarer and then maybe have a mount somewhere near the stern for an iPad for when I fish, since I've already got an iPad that I don't typically use at home anyway.

 

[Hookup1]

Garmin 932xsv is a excellent unit and value. Screen is a little small for my use but it replaced a GPSMAP 4208 that had lower screen resolution. The built-in maps are state-of-the-art. I did add a chart chip to get coastal relied maps but that isn't necessary. I use it with a GT51M-TH for chirp, SideVu and DownVu. My overhead unit that it replaced was primarily used for sonar while my lower helm station GPSMAP 4210 unit is navigation and multifunction displays.

The new units (including the 943xsv) support ActiveCaptain (free Garmin app). It allows you to control the unit from the app as if you were at the helm. Its not really a second screen - it takes over and both displays will be the same and can be controlled from either one. Big issue will be sunlight readability of the tablet.

I have been shopping to replace the 4210 for a year now, looking at size and screen resolution. It will probably be a 8612xsv. Garmin did not announce any new chart plotters at the Fort Lauderdale Boat Show this year.

 

[Mustang65fbk]

I do understand that about the iPad, that it's not its own screen to where you can do what you want on it separately, but it's basically just mirroring the display at the helm. I think for only having a 22' boat and the type/location of where I go fishing, that only one display is likely all that I'd need, with the exception of maybe using an iPad as well. I think a 9" display on a 22' boat would be doable, especially since when you get up to the 10" units then you're upwards of $2,500 or even more than that. I think the 943xsv along with maybe a Fantom 18" Garmin radar and maybe a mirroring iPad would be more than adequate for my setup. It'd be a bit different if I was going 40-50 miles out for tuna or other fish, but I basically row from the shore of my cabin out a hundred yards or so to my boat on the buoy and then start trolling for fish right there. Radar would be a very nice feature as we can get some very heavy morning fog and it's always nice to see where you're going, especially in a boat while on the water.

 

[Hookup1]

You can save some money on the lower end radar unit too. Fantom is their top of the line. I have an older GMR18 and its very good.

 

[Mustang65fbk]

I see on the Garmin website that the older, less expensive radar units like the GMR also have a power output of 4kw as opposed to 40w? I believe 4kw would be equal to 4000w and seems like that would use a ton of power on my boat? I guess the difference between the $1599 GMR 18xHD radar and the $1999 Fantom radar wouldn't be enough to deter me from going with the better model. I do especially like the tracking on the Fantom radar and knowing which way the ships are going and so forth.

 

[Richard1572]

Well they actually did have a pretty good deal at the Ft. Lauderdale boat show via The GPS Store. I was able to save over $500 vs the best online price I could find for the package of chartplotter, radar, transducer, fuel sensors and NMEA 2000 starter kit. I'll post installation pictures as I go.

 

[Mustang65fbk]

Well they actually did have a pretty good deal at the Ft. Lauderdale boat show via The GPS Store. I was able to save over $500 vs the best online price I could find for the package of chartplotter, radar, transducer, fuel sensors and NMEA 2000 starter kit. I'll post installation pictures as I go.

Good deal! I've been incredibly disappointed over the past couple of years with the boat shows here locally in Seattle. The vendors basically have the mindset of "this is our price, which is retail/msrp, if you don't like it, move along." At the time, I had my other boat and looked online to compare the prices of the vendors at the boat shows along with online competitors and the online companies were still oftentimes the same price or even considerably less. I thought to myself "why buy here when I have to pay tax and it's not even a deal? It's the same price or even considerably more buying here as opposed to buying online." The boat show here isn't until January, so I guess if we even have one this year, I'll see if there are any deals to be had. Good to hear that you found a deal and they're making it competitive at least.

 

[Boosted1]

I installed a garmin 942 in mine last year. Of course, the 943 came out like 2 weeks later. I used some 1/4” black plexiglass to install the unit and then made a door to the right to I could use that dead space as a glove box. I love how it turned out. I can keep my phone, wallet, keys plus the covers for the units in the box.

 

[SkunkBoat]

I just put in a 1242xsv touch. IMO- Get the big one and put it in the left (closer). One big touch screen is better than two small ones. I use a 3 way split sometimes and its still greeat but full screen is great when you are panning and zooming and the split chart/radar is still big enough to be usable.

 

[Richard1572]

I just put in a 1242xsv touch. IMO- Get the big one and put it in the left (closer). One big touch screen is better than two small ones. I use a 3 way split sometimes and its still greeat but full screen is great when you are panning and zooming and the split chart/radar is still big enough to be usable.

I did get the larger one, the 1243 XSV but I’m going to do whatever mods are necessary to get it installed in the dash directly in front of me at the helm, not to the side. I sat at the helm for a while and found it awkward to operate down and to the left. It’s going to be a very tight squeeze to fit in the dash and maybe even require some cutting of the top of the dash. It arrives today so while I’ve been doing a lot of measuring based on the online dimensions the real test is going to using the actual unit to determine how much modes are going to be necessary.

 

[Hookup1]

It's worth the extra effort. This is an older 4210 that I plan to replace with a 8612xsv. The 1243xsv is a great unit and value but I prefer the higher screen resolution of the 8612xsv. If you are tight on space the 8610xsv has the best resolution of all the units and is $200 less than the price of the 1243xsv.

I have a 943xsv in the overhead as well.

 

[Mustang65fbk]

I think a big part of it depends on the size of the boat that you've got. On a 228 Seafarer that has the flip up dash panel, I don't think you could ever fit anything more than a 9" screen in there. Unless you filled in the dash area with some starboard, a carbon fiber panel or something similar. Even then, I don't know if you could get a 12" screen to fit? Maybe you could?

 

[Hookup1]

A lot depends on your use case. If you doing easy back bay or coastal fishing you don't need much. If your running offshore or traveling large distances you need to run several screens at a time. Preferably two displays. New units are almost "frame-less" and don't have keypads. There are lot of creative ways to work a display in - depends on how much you are willing to spend!