I agree totallywith Charles, do not limit your search. Especially since that boat is trailerable. If you can find a boat closer to what you would like to spend, that is in great shape, it is worth it to travel a distance to check it out and pick it up. Especially if you can trailer it yourself, your only really paying for gas. If the boat is cheaper then what you find in your area, it could still turn out to be a great deal. When looking for newer boats, there are often less of them for sale and a search must be broadened to a larger area in order to find what you truely are looking for. Instead of possibly settling, find the best boat out there for your money, it may be in another state...
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Robalo vs. Grady White
- Thread starter dmccorki
- Start date
The 225s I looked at locally were only 9 months old and had 23 and 54 hours on their respective engines. They looked brand new so I felt comfortable in pursuing. They sold so quickly it appears others also felt comfortable.
Being new to boating I have been reluctant to take on the challenges of long distant purchase since I have never trailered a boat and have had little experience with surveyors.
My first experience with a surveyor was interesting. I was looking at a used Pursuit which appeared to have some issues with the transom. While I was scheduling a surveryor, another buyer's surveryor personally bought the boat when his buyer could not make up his mind.
Charles, just fyi re asking and selling prices, I believe the 2007 225s mentioned above both sold, with trailers, for $55000. The ask was 59900.
Thanks again for all your advice. I will broaden my search.
Doug
Being new to boating I have been reluctant to take on the challenges of long distant purchase since I have never trailered a boat and have had little experience with surveyors.
My first experience with a surveyor was interesting. I was looking at a used Pursuit which appeared to have some issues with the transom. While I was scheduling a surveryor, another buyer's surveryor personally bought the boat when his buyer could not make up his mind.
Charles, just fyi re asking and selling prices, I believe the 2007 225s mentioned above both sold, with trailers, for $55000. The ask was 59900.
Thanks again for all your advice. I will broaden my search.
Doug
tuxedospike
Well-Known Member
G/W vs. Rabalo
To me it does not matter what brand, what model, or what time of year it is...I'm not buying without a sea trial...period! I don't buy shoes without trying them on...I don't buy a new or used car without driving it first. Those folks who told you that "ride" was very important are right. There is nothing so sad as spending a bunch of "hard-earned" cash on a boat that you really don't want to spend time on because you don't like the ride, or it handles badly or it just does not fit you ! Make a deal now if you don't want to wait but make the sale (or any transfer of money) contingent upon passing a "sea-trial" in the Spring with you as the judge.
To me it does not matter what brand, what model, or what time of year it is...I'm not buying without a sea trial...period! I don't buy shoes without trying them on...I don't buy a new or used car without driving it first. Those folks who told you that "ride" was very important are right. There is nothing so sad as spending a bunch of "hard-earned" cash on a boat that you really don't want to spend time on because you don't like the ride, or it handles badly or it just does not fit you ! Make a deal now if you don't want to wait but make the sale (or any transfer of money) contingent upon passing a "sea-trial" in the Spring with you as the judge.
engineersx2
GreatGrady Captain
dmccorki, your posting hit home with me. I purchased a new 208 GW in 1995 and owned it for 5 years until it was lost in a major fire in a boatel in Va. Beach. I paid approx. 28k for the boat in 1995 and in 2000, after the fire, the insurance company (Allstate) paid me 23,500 for my loss. I felt pretty good only loosing 4,500 for owning the boat for 5 yrs and putting more than 500 hrs on it.
It took me 5 years to make the plung again to purchase another boat. So, in July 2005 we purchased a new Robalo 235 (with a single 225 HP Yamaha) for about 56k. It was loaded with a hardtop (but no trailer), had alot of standard features - about the same as the GW 232. The main problem with the boat was that it was underpowered... and to be honest, it was NOT a Grady-white.
Soon after the purchase, both my wife and I realized that we should have spent the extra $ and got the boat that we wanted ( GW 232). We were lucky enough that after notifying the dealer that we were not happy with the Robalo, he found a buyer for the boat and we were able to sell for about 6k less than we paid. We did put about 100 hrs on the Robalo in the 11 months that we owned it. Had the boat had twin 150's , we would have kept it longer. But to be honest, we never fell in love with the Robalo.
After owning the 208 GW, we always were comparing our Robalo to the GW and realizing that we compromized. Not that compromizing is bad... but I am glad to say that we took another plunge over the weekend and purchased the boat of our dreams, that being a 2008 GW 232 Gulfstream with twin 150's. My stratgy this time was to finance for 15 yrs vs. 10 yrs for the Robalo. Monthly payments are not that much more and we have a GW!
If you want to see our Robalo, I believe the owner that purchased it from us is now trying to sell it at: http://www.airtimewatersports.com/usedboats.html
Airtime is a great dealership and a great place to purchase a Robalo if you are interested.
I know it sounds odd, but I am so looking foward to calling the boatel to ask them to put or GW in the water (vs. our Robalo) and can not wait for spring!
I will be posting the photo's of our new GW 232 soon! For those that may go to the Va. Beach Boat show this weekend, our new boat is the one with the SOLD sign on it.
glad to be back to the GW family!
R. Nielsen
Suffolk, Virginia
It took me 5 years to make the plung again to purchase another boat. So, in July 2005 we purchased a new Robalo 235 (with a single 225 HP Yamaha) for about 56k. It was loaded with a hardtop (but no trailer), had alot of standard features - about the same as the GW 232. The main problem with the boat was that it was underpowered... and to be honest, it was NOT a Grady-white.
Soon after the purchase, both my wife and I realized that we should have spent the extra $ and got the boat that we wanted ( GW 232). We were lucky enough that after notifying the dealer that we were not happy with the Robalo, he found a buyer for the boat and we were able to sell for about 6k less than we paid. We did put about 100 hrs on the Robalo in the 11 months that we owned it. Had the boat had twin 150's , we would have kept it longer. But to be honest, we never fell in love with the Robalo.
After owning the 208 GW, we always were comparing our Robalo to the GW and realizing that we compromized. Not that compromizing is bad... but I am glad to say that we took another plunge over the weekend and purchased the boat of our dreams, that being a 2008 GW 232 Gulfstream with twin 150's. My stratgy this time was to finance for 15 yrs vs. 10 yrs for the Robalo. Monthly payments are not that much more and we have a GW!
If you want to see our Robalo, I believe the owner that purchased it from us is now trying to sell it at: http://www.airtimewatersports.com/usedboats.html
Airtime is a great dealership and a great place to purchase a Robalo if you are interested.
I know it sounds odd, but I am so looking foward to calling the boatel to ask them to put or GW in the water (vs. our Robalo) and can not wait for spring!
I will be posting the photo's of our new GW 232 soon! For those that may go to the Va. Beach Boat show this weekend, our new boat is the one with the SOLD sign on it.
glad to be back to the GW family!
R. Nielsen
Suffolk, Virginia
Average Joe
Well-Known Member
engineersx2 said:dmccorki, your posting hit home with me. I purchased a new 208 GW in 1995 and owned it for 5 years until it was lost in a major fire in a boatel in Va. Beach. I paid approx. 28k for the boat in 1995 and in 2000, after the fire, the insurance company (Allstate) paid me 23,500 for my loss. I felt pretty good only loosing 4,500 for owning the boat for 5 yrs and putting more than 500 hrs on it.
It took me 5 years to make the plung again to purchase another boat. So, in July 2005 we purchased a new Robalo 235 (with a single 225 HP Yamaha) for about 56k. It was loaded with a hardtop (but no trailer), had alot of standard features - about the same as the GW 232. The main problem with the boat was that it was underpowered... and to be honest, it was NOT a Grady-white.
Soon after the purchase, both my wife and I realized that we should have spent the extra $ and got the boat that we wanted ( GW 232). We were lucky enough that after notifying the dealer that we were not happy with the Robalo, he found a buyer for the boat and we were able to sell for about 6k less than we paid. We did put about 100 hrs on the Robalo in the 11 months that we owned it. Had the boat had twin 150's , we would have kept it longer. But to be honest, we never fell in love with the Robalo.
After owning the 208 GW, we always were comparing our Robalo to the GW and realizing that we compromized. Not that compromizing is bad... but I am glad to say that we took another plunge over the weekend and purchased the boat of our dreams, that being a 2008 GW 232 Gulfstream with twin 150's. My stratgy this time was to finance for 15 yrs vs. 10 yrs for the Robalo. Monthly payments are not that much more and we have a GW!
If you want to see our Robalo, I believe the owner that purchased it from us is now trying to sell it at: http://www.airtimewatersports.com/usedboats.html
Airtime is a great dealership and a great place to purchase a Robalo if you are interested.
I know it sounds odd, but I am so looking foward to calling the boatel to ask them to put or GW in the water (vs. our Robalo) and can not wait for spring!
I will be posting the photo's of our new GW 232 soon! For those that may go to the Va. Beach Boat show this weekend, our new boat is the one with the SOLD sign on it.
glad to be back to the GW family!
R. Nielsen
Suffolk, Virginia
We saw your new boat at the show and although the saleman told us we could come onboard we declined out of respect for the owner.
Congratulations!
I know what the asking price was and would love to know what the actual sale price was if you are inclined to share. If not I understand. I'm just trying to get an idea in case I trade up in the next year.
striped bass
Well-Known Member
Here is another nice Tournament 225 with a trailer for sale just south of your location. Might be worth a look.
http://adcache.boattraderonline.com/6/8/0/89598180.htm
http://adcache.boattraderonline.com/6/8/0/89598180.htm
Charles
Thanks for input. I will follow up.
Talked to a dealer about a 2005 with just over 100 hours on the F250. Will try to see it this weekend. US Boats says the asking price is a little high but still worth a look. I have used USBoats for guidance on selling prices since they see the numbers on their insurance side. Any thoughts on their values estimates?
Doug
Thanks for input. I will follow up.
Talked to a dealer about a 2005 with just over 100 hours on the F250. Will try to see it this weekend. US Boats says the asking price is a little high but still worth a look. I have used USBoats for guidance on selling prices since they see the numbers on their insurance side. Any thoughts on their values estimates?
Doug
striped bass
Well-Known Member
A 2005 with 100 hours. Would be a convenient purchase if close buy. My recommendation would be to consult also with NADA and BUC price guidelines. Here are some BUC guidelines I used to purchase my 225. Ask a dealer to let you read the latest BUC Guidelines (published quarterly). The explanations in the front are important to read. I hope the formatting is not disrupted the columns in the post.
MANUFACTURER MODEL SIZE YEAR PRICE
LOW - HIGH RETAIL
GRADY WHITE 225 TOURNAMENT 22
1997 19000-21100
1998 20100-22300
1999 21400-23800
2000 23900-26500
2001 25000-27800
2002 26900-29900
2003 33000-36700
2004 35700-39700
2005 38600-42900
2006 42100-46800
MANUFACTURER MODEL SIZE YEAR PRICE
LOW - HIGH RETAIL
GRADY WHITE 225 TOURNAMENT 22
1997 19000-21100
1998 20100-22300
1999 21400-23800
2000 23900-26500
2001 25000-27800
2002 26900-29900
2003 33000-36700
2004 35700-39700
2005 38600-42900
2006 42100-46800
Thanks. NADA does not provide price with engine so one has to put the two pieces together,but the combined number looks a little higher than the BUC price on your chart. Your earlier suggestion of 10-20% below asking price would bring it in line. I will try to take a look at the boat this weekend.
gradyfish22
GreatGrady Captain
Also NADA prices for boats are notorious for being low. With today's market those prices may be close to what boats are actually selling for but their projected values have always been known to be on the low side.
Gradyfish
Thanks for input. Interestingly the BUC values that Charles provided also agree with the USBoat value service. A learning experience for me, but I found the USBoat folks to be very helpful in that they gave me a list of the actual purchase prices that customers provided when insuring their boats. I assume most owners will insure their boats for something close to what it cost them since a few thousand difference in value has very little impact on insurance cost.
And I thought the used car market was a challenge!
Doug
Thanks for input. Interestingly the BUC values that Charles provided also agree with the USBoat value service. A learning experience for me, but I found the USBoat folks to be very helpful in that they gave me a list of the actual purchase prices that customers provided when insuring their boats. I assume most owners will insure their boats for something close to what it cost them since a few thousand difference in value has very little impact on insurance cost.
And I thought the used car market was a challenge!
Doug
BobP
GreatGrady Captain
- Joined
- Apr 27, 2005
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- Long Island, NY
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Why can't the member look at several of the same boats he's interested in, compare condition and equipment, what needs to be fixed, compare prices, then make an offer based on the legwork. If I was selling a boat, and a buyer told me I was higher than book, I would say: so what!
What does book value have to do with anything? It's recent sales and market conditions that matter, like how many of the same boats are for sale, how fast they sell, what time of the season - in season or after season, what part of country selling - up here prices are higher, coming recession?? etc.
Just like houses ?
And you can insure the boat for whatever you want, not what you paid for it. You decide the insured value. You can insure it for half if you wanted. And that will be the payout.
It is not like cars at all.
What does book value have to do with anything? It's recent sales and market conditions that matter, like how many of the same boats are for sale, how fast they sell, what time of the season - in season or after season, what part of country selling - up here prices are higher, coming recession?? etc.
Just like houses ?
And you can insure the boat for whatever you want, not what you paid for it. You decide the insured value. You can insure it for half if you wanted. And that will be the payout.
It is not like cars at all.
jehines3
Well-Known Member
I could not get my insurer to cover the boat for any higher than I paid, I've tried with two seperate insurance carriers and and three seperate boats. I never pay more than NADA low retail hull and motors, no options for a boat, so there are allot of reasons to try and insure for more.
I got a heck of a deal and could not replace the boat as-is, where-is for what I paid. That said, if I repower or make substatial upgrades I can have the policy reevaluated according to my insurer. I can see why an insurer will not over value a policy, there is just too much risk for the underwriter. On an AGV policy they will not allow it to exceed internal thresholds for published selling figures on the vessel. I would prefer a book policy if my insurer wrote them, but I still think they consider amount paid aginst one of the above mentioned pricing guides. Each insurer varies and that has been my experience over my 5 boats. jh
I got a heck of a deal and could not replace the boat as-is, where-is for what I paid. That said, if I repower or make substatial upgrades I can have the policy reevaluated according to my insurer. I can see why an insurer will not over value a policy, there is just too much risk for the underwriter. On an AGV policy they will not allow it to exceed internal thresholds for published selling figures on the vessel. I would prefer a book policy if my insurer wrote them, but I still think they consider amount paid aginst one of the above mentioned pricing guides. Each insurer varies and that has been my experience over my 5 boats. jh
White Horses (Mike)
GreatGrady Captain
If you feel that your boat is worth more than the insurer's book value, they should write you a policy for a higher number IF you provide an appraisal that confirms your higher number.
At least that has been my experience.
At least that has been my experience.
striped bass
Well-Known Member
Here is a fully loaded 2005 GW Tournament 225 not far from your location in Ocean City. Might be worth a look.
http://www.usedboats.com/powerboats/200 ... 564967.htm
http://www.usedboats.com/powerboats/200 ... 564967.htm
BobP
GreatGrady Captain
- Joined
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Speaking of older boats -
When the insurance company asked what you paid, why not say, it was a gift, or it's private, or make up a price ?
Why tell them what you paid ?
Why do you think it's their business to know ?
I prefer the "need to know" approach, when I aked why they wanted that info, they just said it was a line on the form - the person was filling it out over the phone. So much for that.
I wanted to see how the premium was effected by different "values", so I asked for quotes for different values, to see if it was worth the extra premium to me, and was it proportional; premium vs. value.
Learned a lot and decided for myself the risk assessment.
I would think most are not interested to know how the proportionality of premium vs. stated value works, I was.
I'm sure the underwriters check to see how reasonable the stated value is, I can't say my '92 is $1M stated value, or even if you own any boat at all. They wanted the address and said they would visit the boat, took pictures - never knew if they did or not - perhaps just a "scare tactic" for the scammers.
The boat insurance business is like any other business, more stated value, more revenue in premiums.
For those who call up and just want insurance, the insurance company will figure out what you need - a good way is the "what you paid"approach, as I expect most will not care nor have the interest I have.
If you repower your boat one day, I guarantee they will up your value as much as you want, within reason. You will see.
For the reasons I stated above, next time insure it for more than you really want initially, you can always reduce it later any time you want. wqith no reason at all.
But going up is not so easy, but hints are above, how about - rebuilt powerheads you did yourself.....?
When the insurance company asked what you paid, why not say, it was a gift, or it's private, or make up a price ?
Why tell them what you paid ?
Why do you think it's their business to know ?
I prefer the "need to know" approach, when I aked why they wanted that info, they just said it was a line on the form - the person was filling it out over the phone. So much for that.
I wanted to see how the premium was effected by different "values", so I asked for quotes for different values, to see if it was worth the extra premium to me, and was it proportional; premium vs. value.
Learned a lot and decided for myself the risk assessment.
I would think most are not interested to know how the proportionality of premium vs. stated value works, I was.
I'm sure the underwriters check to see how reasonable the stated value is, I can't say my '92 is $1M stated value, or even if you own any boat at all. They wanted the address and said they would visit the boat, took pictures - never knew if they did or not - perhaps just a "scare tactic" for the scammers.
The boat insurance business is like any other business, more stated value, more revenue in premiums.
For those who call up and just want insurance, the insurance company will figure out what you need - a good way is the "what you paid"approach, as I expect most will not care nor have the interest I have.
If you repower your boat one day, I guarantee they will up your value as much as you want, within reason. You will see.
For the reasons I stated above, next time insure it for more than you really want initially, you can always reduce it later any time you want. wqith no reason at all.
But going up is not so easy, but hints are above, how about - rebuilt powerheads you did yourself.....?
gw204
Well-Known Member
jehines3
Well-Known Member
BobP I used to do forensic work for insurance companies and law firms, including BoatUS and a few other marine carriers. The investigation of claims, including any policy binded information is all a stepping stone to a denied claim for the carrier. An insurance company loves to deny a cliam of the "insured lied in application or underwriting"
Since that job, I have a firm understanding of how much an insurance company will spend to defer, deny, or subrogate a claim, I'm on the up and up with my insurance carriers.
To each his own, but a carrier to deny a claim due to a bold face lie, is not unheard of. It is called fraud. When you sign the application you have affirmed that everything is correct. This is usually not scrutinized until you ask your insurer to pay out money. I knew I always had a good investigation when the insured declined an examination under oath (EUO). If your underwriter asks a question your answer better be correct. There are exceptions for the oh I forgot, and the like, but I paid $40k for the boat when all the checks only add to $25k a week ago, you will have big problems when it comes time to use what your policy is designed for.
When I repower I will file appropritely with my carrier. jh
Since that job, I have a firm understanding of how much an insurance company will spend to defer, deny, or subrogate a claim, I'm on the up and up with my insurance carriers.
To each his own, but a carrier to deny a claim due to a bold face lie, is not unheard of. It is called fraud. When you sign the application you have affirmed that everything is correct. This is usually not scrutinized until you ask your insurer to pay out money. I knew I always had a good investigation when the insured declined an examination under oath (EUO). If your underwriter asks a question your answer better be correct. There are exceptions for the oh I forgot, and the like, but I paid $40k for the boat when all the checks only add to $25k a week ago, you will have big problems when it comes time to use what your policy is designed for.
When I repower I will file appropritely with my carrier. jh